Regarding GS/White Shepherds - Page 1

Why are white german shepherds listed as their own breed?

I understand that there is a group who are attempting to validate them as their own breed, but as of right now, they are all registered with the AKC as german shepherds.

The only reason I ask, is because my dog is the offspring of a white german shepherd and a black german shepherd. By AKC standards, they are the same breed, but here, there is no way to connect some of the dogs in her pedigree, due to the fact that it seems the system won't allow 'interbreeding'. This seems silly to me, as it restricts my ability to further learn my dog's pedigree. What's more, some of those white shepherds have german shepherd parents, grandparents, and great grand parents - does simply being born white suddenly change the breed so drastically that it's entirely different? And some are listed as white shepherds, when they are, in fact, registered as black/tan, black/gold, black/red etc.

I just want to be able to trace her pedigree as thoroughly as I can :c

Edit; I'm also trying to expand on the dogs that are related to her, and the dogs in her pedigree, by finding OFA results from ancestors and their relations, for better understanding on the genetics of her pedigree, and again, I cannot do this as I am restricted from using 'white shepherds' in a german shepherd's pedigree.

Edit x2: Unlesss the listing is meant to facility BBS/WSS pedigrees? Why would one register a white german shepherd born from black/tan parents under an entirely different breed/standard?

In the US, white shepherd people can do anything with their dogs that owners of "colored" shepherds can do other than show them in conformation at AKC shows.

You can search the OFA database for hip, elbow, and health information using German Shepherd. You will see many white GSD's in their database so there is no reason that  you can't complete a pedigree. What's the problem?

Yes, I'm fully aware of that. I've got nothing against white german shepherds, or white swiss shepherds. c: There just seems to be a discrepency between who is using the option? I don't know if that makes sense, lol.

The problem is that I am attempting to complete the pedigree on this website, and the website does not allow you to use a white shepherd as a parent of a german shepherd. For example, if I'm trying to add a dog, and it's father is already listed as a german shepherd on the site, but it's mother (which is a registered german shepherd) is listed as a white shepherd, the option to link the mother to the offspring is not available.

I guess mostly it's an inconvenience and makes very little sense to me? This website is, for me, a convenient way to travel back into my dog's ancestory, and when there's a hiccup, I get concerned that the dog isn't there, when it's already listed, just as a seperate breed.

Please, forgive me if I'm being ignorant. I'm just genuinely curious, because I'm seeing a lot of modge podges where a dog's grandparents on one side are gsd, and on the other, white shepherd, and I'm curious as to how you achieve that when it won't let you choose a parent that's a different breed form what you're registering.

Pirate, I understand your problem, but this is an international board, and the "White Shepherd/Swiss Shepherd" is listed as an own breed in most of the countries of this world. AKC thinks different.
According to the most standards your dog officially is a mixed breed - this doesn´t change your dog, though , but he is no purebred German Shepherd, same story are the White Shepherds listed as descendants of "regular" German Shepherds - there ancestors either are mixes ( not uncommon at all in the United States ), or the peds are a fake.

Winning the jackpot is easier as to see a living white German Shepherd out of regular colored ancestors with proven pedigrees.

Forgot to mention, in the beginning of this board people were able to register regular colors AND white colors, if I remember well. A lot of dogs were and still are registered twice. The admins should know exactly.

That hardly makes any sense. White is a recessive masking gene in shepherds. Genetically speaking, her father is a normal colored german shepherd (likely a bicolor or a black and tan) - it is simply hidden by a mask of white.

I'm not talking about german shepherd dogs crossed with actual white swiss or berger blanc shepherds. To my knowledge, the bbs/wss were established FROM white german shepherds. Horhand's great grandsire on his mother's side was white.

This is not about sense, but about reality. "White" was forbidden in 1933 - there were no white dogs used for breeding for 82 years now within SV, the "creator" of the official standard. No white dogs in Europe besides the United Kingdom, but some whites in the United States and in Canada, too. A guy ( sorry, a lady ) from Switzerland imported 2 dogs in the late 60s and started breeding. This was the beginning of the "Berger Blanc Suisse", they are  an own breed.
Even if a white puppy would be born out of regular colored parents this would be no Berger Blanc, but a faulty ( not allowed to be bred ) German Shepherd dog - I have never seen one, and I have never heard about one, although I had intense contact to a lot of breeders for decades. Not saying, it´s not possible, but again, the chance is like winning the jackpot.

Evilpirateduck, send me a PM with a link to your dog.

Yes, but again, Horand's great grandsire was white, which means that Horand would have carried the white gene. The breed was inbred heavily on him to develop the breed, which would mean that he would have passed that recessive gene on.

Whether or not a dog shows the recessive, if it carries the gene and then produces pups, those pups have the chance to carry the gene as well. Simply because they are not allowing them to be bred, does not mean that the gene would be lost especially considering that the german shepherd was officially recognized by the AKC in 1908 - almost 20 years prior to whites being forbidden by the SV. That means that there could very well have been white german shepherds running around in the US before that happened. The GSDCA did not adopt the exclusively colored standard until 1958.

I'm sorry if I'm coming off strong, but you just basically told me that my dog is either of mixed origin, or sketchy origin. That's mildly upsetting, to say the very least.

Sorry in case I offended you - I just tried to explain the differences between the German Shepherd dog, the Berger Blanc, and a White German Shepherd dog. Like Blitzen already mentioned within AKC and CKC there is no problem, your problem are the pedigree/breed rules on the board. It's difficult with the whites - an AKC pedigreed white shepherd is not even allowed to be used in European breeding programs because of these problems.