Help a biologist - rapid trait evolution study - Page 1

Hi everyone, I'm an evolutionary biologist at the University of California. I study rapid trait changes in nature and thought it would be interesting to play with trait change data potentially available here, due to selection by breeders. I'm wondering whether the pedigrees on this site contain trait data for each individual in a lineage. Traits can be of any sort, so long as they are in type (not observed from a photo). If there is information like color tone or hair length or body size or running speed etc etc (any trait) for a whole lineage of individuals (i.e. in a pedigree), that would be interesting to investigate. Pedigrees with information on what breeders are selecting for, and how fast those traits change through generations are particularly interesting. Does anyone know if this data is available here or elsewhere?

Many thanks!
Dave

I have not see it if it is.  

the trait of gsd breeders to rapidly change the direction of their breeding program to incorporate the "what's hot" flavor-of-the-month-super-stud?

Color and height are available on some dogs but this information is really not searchable (could be in the future). Please feel free to contact me by PM if you would like to discuss this further.



Send personal message to GSD Admin (admin)  

What you are looking for is a breeder's stud book or linages data, which pedigrees do not offer.
But there are some people that do keep detailed recoreds of their dogs, breeding, faults and acheivements.
Sadly i don't personally know of any.
My dad who use to show and race Homing pigeons always said dog pedigrees were useless. No info is provided.
Best of luck in your search.
Fry

Well, if you concentrate on the German Shepherd Dog, there is something called the Koer, or breed report.  This report records a description of the dog in phenotype, and some characteristics such as it "outing" on a bite or not.  Not all gsds have this report done, however, in Germany this is still a requirement prior to breeding.  Owners of gsds on this side of the pond who are traditional about their dog will also have this report.

Certainly one can see there have been fairly rapid changes in the gsd over the last century to the point where many would agree there are two types of dog now- the working lines (tending to be boxier and darker) and the show lines (tending to have sloping backs with smaller skulls and most often the saddleback).





 

Being as the GSD has only been around for about a century, one can say there definately have been rapid changes in the breed. It would seem that going back through books from early days, till present, those physical changes are obvious. There are still small pockets of breeders producing dogs which are sound and still have the working structure and temperament as the breed was originally.

I sent you a PM with a breeder that has been around a long time and has kept rather detailed records.  They might be able to help you.

The DNA testing for the stud books has some types recorded.  I don't know what each of the types is that they are tracking, but there are many people who run the DNA tests, and that might help you.  I'd be interested in whatever you come up with, so feel free to come back to the group and post your results/report/findings.  

 I ASSume you speaking of temperament traits and innate drives? I have not seen any fine definition of those *traits* per say on databases. Some may say the Koer or stud book is just that.. to a small extent it is reliable in knowing the dogs have executed a certain performance, the definition of how their traits were exspressed in training is NOT there. Further because of training it has certainly been altered to a degree to achieve our desire affect ? I know for myself familiarity with family bloodlines what seems to be prepotent in innate drives/traits and the availability of desired traits to be easily worked with or altered if you would like to say that is  essential for selection. Breeders with generations of experience in their program may or may not have *data* to support those years of knowledge, But could be a niche of obtaining help or information?

IF you are speaking of physical traits and health issues, that too different too in selection for many..Yes we now have some  dna health tests subjective and innacurate to say the least. And the old standbys for certificaton while tools  can be subjective in relation to the actual genetics, transmission modes, etc. Not so long ago it was  not known that  dna matter can and does alter/change...this relatively new discovery in medicine is what in the next decade may very well have us all going WTF were we thinking??? It should be  an interesting time. 

Perhaps elaborate more on the basics of your study and more about what traits you are focusing on and are needing?