it really begs the question - Page 1

all the threads i have read here about people getting ripped off by breeders in other countries makes me question why with all the well known reputable breeders all around the world why someone would buy a dog without seeing it in person or meeting the breeder in person and doing so from known problem areas. makes no sense spending all that money to import and have yr hopes set on a breeding dog...?????

not judging and bad things just should not happen period, but they do. how/why do people get in these positions i mean they are not getting a dog from the sunday classifieds they are dealing with multiple gov agencies, international flights....makes no sense.

I see what you are talking about vk4GSD, the list is big just on the first page. More scamming due to they keep getting away with it.
Sadly until you have been there and ripped off, you might learn. But sadly it is hard to see through many of the lies and cheaters.
After 7 years in WL GSD's sadly it isn't easy unless you know lines, dogs and people, or ask here as I am finding out, :)
But even then their friends will get up and lie for them.
There really should be a place to record all bad breeders and their scams to start stopping them from continuing and filling up our shelters with expensive crap no one knows about.
Sadly it will go on.
I have worked hard learning lines and dogs and am happy to say I have the right people in my life to ask, but limited to only my country and it saddens me.
Thank you to the honest people here helping others, keep up the great work. Might be easier to set up an easy place here to look up bad breeders, a thought.

Well they do pop up on Ripoff Report, but obviously the wronged person needs to put them on.  I was very lucky with the first two dogs I imported sight unseen and since then we got ripped off by a trainer in Germany and any dogs we have bought since have been viewed personally, tested, purchased and taken on the spot.  Yes, this has resulted in at least one wasted trip to Germany, expensive, but still cheaper than if we had bought the dog and found out he was not what we wanted when he got here.

Margaret N-J

Many of those who come to this site do so ONLY AFTER being ripped off and many are only first time users. What happened to RESEARCH First get to know who you are buying from?
They do it all back to front and then come here to slam the kennel that ripped them off.



I have ( so far ) not had a bad experience with other kennels/breeders though I have bought dogs that didn't turn out as I had hoped but I didn't blame the breeders for that.

Apologies ..... I have had 1 my very first female purchased from an importer / breeder, at 7 months the poor girl had so many skeletal problems I had to return her, it took me 4 months and many phone call but I did finally receive a cheque for the full purchase price. The breeder did sell her on and failed to change her registration details, when she was 2 years old I was contacted by animal control, she was still registered in my name, they said that she was in a very poor state, lame, malnourished and possibly had cancer and the kindest thing would be to put her to sleep and would I give them permission?

as bad as it may look, i think it really does look worse than it is...there are like what 2,000 breeders ads on here, multiply that by 5-10 puppies, so you got possibly 20,000 sales/customers out of that if we see 20 bad experiences and lets say 200 those who did not complain, so overall satisfaction percentage is actually pretty high...220 complaints out of 20,000 is 1.10%....so with 98.9% satisfaction i say that's a pretty successful business with overall high customer satisfaction.

Before importing a dog I did some research on the seller. I used the search facility on this database to find details re the Kennel, the inputs the seller had made on various topics on the forums and checked via the internet as to whether others had purchased dogs from him.  My sense from the aforementioned and from the emails and conversations with the seller was that he was honest, keen to ensure that the dog for sale was suitable for my needs and level of experience and that he was a genuine and trustworthy man. I transferred funds, albeit with a little understandable apprehension and was delighted to receive a call advising payment had been received and transport arrangements made.  Perhaps we could have a Ratings and Feedback Section on the database where buyers could rate their buying experiences -eg name of individual/ kennel purchased from , ease of purchase, speed/quality of service provided, quality/health of dog received, /follow up action by seller when problems arose etc -  This could prove to be an invaluable resource for potential buyers.!
 
 

Well, that is a good questions on which you can take many positions, and here is mine:

First let's agree on one thing...all breeders (especially in North America) are claiming to be in GSD world to better the GSD breed and as a hobby.
Non of the breeders is stating that they do this for business, right? 
Yet when you try to buy a 2-3 year  old dog from most breeders in North America they will charge you arm and leg for the dog.
I believe that the current standard price in North America (NA) for a breed worthy GSD female with IPO1 title is anywhere from $4K to $10+K. Price for a breed worthy male (again in NA) GSD with IPO1 title starts from $4K and goes to who know what.... Price of a puppy in NA is starting at $1500 and goes up to $5000
Why am I pointing out these prices and mentioning NA breeders (in general) ​ claiming to be in GSD world to better the GSD breed and as a hobby? Well clearly most of the GSD brereders in NA are not in for hoby and to better the bread....they are in for bussines, simply bussines. 
So why do people (yes, also NA breeders) buy oversees in "risky to buy" countries like: Slovakia (net income $856), Czech Republic (net income $963), Serbia (net income $479), Hungary (net income $650), Croatia (net income $959), etc.? 

Simple answer is: Puppy prices over there in those countries start at $300 and go up to $700, Female dogs with IPO1 title start at $1500 and males is no different. Add to these prices shipping cost of approximately $800 and do your math.
People find that these price differences are worth risking and loosing money. LadyFrost already pointed out the percentages of issues happening in her post.

For GSD breeders in NA is the same case as regular puppy/dog buyers, but they are in for business as simple principle works here, low cost input-high cost output/profit on puppy prices and resale of dogs here in NA.

If the majority of NA breeders would be truly in all of this for bettering of the breed and as a hobby, we would definitely see somewhat "normal" pricing on GSD puppies and dogs. This would happen tramendosly with a genetic pool of a GSD in North America.

Did you ever wonder why all clothing, toys and other manufacturing goods are mostly made in China.....low cost input - high cost output/profit. Hell, they (China) are communist country and we do massive bussines with them....it is all about bussines and profit.

I know that I might be "attacked" by some NA breeders who will read this text, but this is my personal opinion. Also, I would like to apologize to few true GSD breeders in NA whom I have put with my generalization with the majority of "business type" ones.


P.S. I have never imported a dog from over sees (yet).


 

For me, its like Seeofred says, the pricing for same quality of dogs is much better in other countries than USA.  Most of the dogs/lines I'm looking at are much more affordable in Europe.  JMHO

You guys talking about pups/ dogs being cheaper from eu...in the US breeders generally have replacement guarantee, not available in eu. Shipping from eu for adult dog is significantly more than 800. also, in US, one can see the pup/ dog before buying, for generally
less than flying to eu to see the dog before buying. Also, WLs are generally significantly less expensive than SL .

@joanro- here is just one recent example of the price differences. I was looking for a pup out of VA Remo. I found one I really liked and bought for only 700 EURO, and any Remo pup I've found in the USA was at or near $2500, so just do the math.  I purchased said male and am very pleased with him.  of course this is just only one example, I'm sure they all vary.