Why the sudden increase in grip for this? - Page 1

I train my dog in personal protection, well last training we did the bite suit for the second time and the first time this year, usually we just do the jacket, sometimes hidden sleeve, depends what we are doing. We dont ever use a normal sleeve anymore.

So it was her second time on biting legs. The decoy was swining to wards like kicking at her and she would snap at him and grab a hold of his leg.  Well one time he missed accidently and kicked her in the chest.  This ENRAGED her and her reaction was to grab a hold of his inner leg calf area.

But the strange thing is when he hit her for real her grip increased big time? I thought she would have gone into defense with that nasty expression and the grip would have been more weak? but according to him her grip was much stronger the time after she got hit for real.

Me nor my trainers are not fans of beating dogs or anything was just a accident. The reason why he noticed is because last year my dog he said had a better stronger grip, now my dog has gained a few pounds and is not in as good shape as she was in last year. This is because I have not been giving her the hourly swims that i use to due to the fact I am scared to swim her after my friends dog got extremly sick from the water here. I kinda allowed her to let herself go a little bit and the decoy that worked her last year says her grip is not as hard but her courage and aggression is still there if not better.

Any idea why the grip would get better with defense? Also will a dog that got out of shape and less athletic and turned into a more "house dog" lose its grip power compared to what it use to be?

not surprising at all.  in order to get the best performance out of a dog, the dog has to recognise the decoy/helper as a
real threat.  if the dog only sees the helper/decoy as a buddy, friend, plaything, you will never find the natural aggression
in that dog.  now i am not suggesting that you ever harm a dog to achieve this, but it doesn't hurt to piss them off a bit
from time to time.  :)  (good dog)
pjp

Good to hear, It didn't hurt the dog. The dogs reaction was exactly what it should have been.
Hank

Good to hear, It didn't hurt the dog. The dogs reaction was exactly what it should have been.
Hank

Defense bites are, generally, harder bites than prey bites--the dog is fighting for real and is seeking to hurt the opponent. A prey bite is often fuller, but the dog has less need to bite *hard*--that's why the ideal is a balance between prey and defense in gripping behavior.

Christine

Christine,
Very good post.

thank you, i dont know why i always thought the defense bites were so weak, I think people i read just talk about chewy mouthy grips when in defense. Hers was nothing like that when she got raged.  I noticed the few times she as been hit with a clatter stick extreme rage comes out, like shes always aggressive and forward with deep barks but if something like thappens she goes extreme and gets rabid.  Even with training shes still a green dog though compared to many dogs out there we have not trained enough. She gets pretty aggresssive without equipment also and trys to bite.

Once the jacket is slipped she has no interest in it.

It really depends on the dog and the situation.  Full grips are primarily genetic, chewy grips can also be genetic , acquired through improper training, or too much stress.  Dogs in defense will generally bite very hard especially when committed to the fight.  They are slow to regrip.

isnt fight and defense seperate things tho? fight comes with more experience and age? I know dogs that are in fighting mode or whatever people want to call it have some serious hard grips. Like what police dogs get into when taking out a suspect I thought.  She was accidently hit hard in the head with a stick and there was the hsame reaction and bite.  I think the stick broke.  They aren't as careful with her as they are the other dogs even the title ring 2 dogs. Because they say she can handle it.  Still lots of training to get where I want to be.  I still consider her green or level 2.

As far as "shifty grips" -- if a dog is biting in defense and isn't getting any response (having success through the bite), then the dog is more likely to shift his grip to try to have more effect on his opponent. It makes sense--if you're in a fight and you have a hold on your opponent, but your opponent keeps fighting at the same strength, then you should probably try a different hold. Additionally, a dog in a real fight (with another dog, a prey animal who is fighting hard, or a human) needs to stay mobile in order to avoid harm--it's smart to be able to dodge in and out and avoid blows--a set and held grip may be desirable for human purposes, but it's not a great survival skill.

Christine