Headcollars - Page 1

Does anyone use one of these as a training aid? I know schutzhund folk tend to sneer at them, but a head collar was recommended for me to help control a dog that's dog aggressive. I can see the sense of it: if the dog lunges, the nose band tightens to keep the mouth closed. It is also easier to keep the dog's head turned towards you, and keep its attention where it should be.

I went out and bought a Halti, the only type of head collar my pet store carries. It was not cheap: $22.00, and I was not happy at how flimsy both the hardware and the straps were.

After a couple of acclimatization sessions, we tried going for a walk. My dog pulled back, and quickly managed to get the nose band in her mouth, and within the short time it took me to get it out of her mouth damaged it. It's so flimsy it wont take much more of this before it's toast. She can also get the safety strap in her mouth, and chew on it, too. Until I find something safer and sturdier, a head collar is obviously a no-go. However, I will say during the periods when she was not pulling back, it did do a great job of keeping her focus on me. 

I see there are other makes of head collars, some of which may have a better, safer, sturdier design than the Halti. Before I spend any more of my hard-earned money, does anyone have any suggestions? And yes, the collar WAS fitted correctly! But if the dog pulls back, the nose band and the strap below it is within reach of the dog's mouth no matter how high up the band is on the face.
 

"Now picture that dog running towards another animal and hitting the end of the leash with that head collar/halti whatever on her face...can you hear her neck?"

Yep, dangerous and nothing "gentle" about them.  I'll say it again...it is counterintuitive to suggest that any collar or harness can provide the greatest amount of control using the least compulsion...and that is their claim.  I've never seen a happy dog wearing one.

Halti's are not well built, you're very right that they are flimsy and poorly constructed. Gentle leader is better built, had a neck to nose strap that pervents it from sliding around and getting pulled off.

It does not function as a muzzle at all. Don't fool your self on that one. It just follows the same concept that horse people use, if you have the head the rest must follow. If you have an aggressive dog this is the wrong tool. You will never be in control.
Keith i don't think the head halters have any more snap then a sudden hard hit on a choker or prong. And at least the halter don't interfer with the windpipe.
Personally it's another stupid gimic. Your better off with the prong, get control first then back chain to less powerful tools.

Keith and Hired Dog are right about this one. When a dog wearing a headcollar hits the end of the leash, his head is snapped very sharply to the side and backwards because the leash is attached to his muzzle not his neck. This is incredibly dangerous and can cause severe spine injuries. Imagine yourself running full tilt attached to a rope hooked onto a contraption on your head that snapped your head sideways and backwards when you hit the end of the rope. This is very different from what happens with a choke or prong collar, although I have heard of less severe neck injuries with a choke collar. The prong collar has limited constriction so less damage though it will hurt like hell if you get jerked to a hard stop. Better that than a spine injury. I have heard that there were some severe spine injuries and at least one fatality with headcollars and the company shut the owners up but I cannot verify this.

And the dogs for sure hate headcollars. In my stupid ninny all-positive trainer days (which lasted less than four months because I figured out pretty quick how cruel "all-positive" training is), I tried these damn headcollars on about a dozen dogs. Every dog just hated them. Some dogs started to claw their faces bloody to get them off. The same dogs accepted a prong collar right away. A prong collar is too much for some dogs but these dogs can usually be handled OK with a martingale collar or a Dogtra collar set real low or on vibrate. Headcollars are one of the few dog training tools that I consider a total disaster and have no use for at all.

I wish folks would listen to THE DOGS. They're the experts I care the most about and when dogs tell me headcollars make them miserable I'm going to listen to them instead of some "all-positive" trainer who won't pay attention to what the dog is saying.

The best way to control a dog aggressive dog is to teach the dog that the behavior will not be tolerated.  There are several effective ways to deal with dog aggression, but it must be tailored to the individual dog.  I wouldn't use a Halti or a head collar at all, especially for dog aggression.  For seriously dog aggressive dogs avoidance is a good thing to teach the dog.  The dog learns his best option is to completely avoid other dogs; even looking at another dog.  It's all about obedience and control.  

Head collars have their (limited) place in the armoury of dog
training tools.  For instance, with a dog who was dog-aggressive
BUT ALREADY TRAINED TO WALK TO HEEL, a Halti came in
useful for compelling a head-turn towards me (and away from the
approaching dog) thus keeping her attention.

For a very big adult ["Shiloh"] dog who didn't know how to heel but was
fairly laid back and not prone to rushing forward at other canines, (even
though not liking them very much !) and who ACCEPTED ITS CONSTRAINTS
QUICKLY, it was useful in teaching him to walk sensibly.  

Most people don't use prong collars regularly in the UK on the whole,
although they are available, and sometimes you just have to use what
is readily to hand.

'Fry is right about the Gentle Leader, it is better in use than the Halti -
I just wish I could have ever developed the knack of putting the darn
thing on quickly !

If a dog doesn't accept wearing a halter within one walk;  and/or
if a dog can twist and get bits of the halter out of shape / in his mouth/
off his head / over his eye(s)  - you should stop using it and try some
other method.  Not all dogs react badly to them, not all dogs will hurt
themselves on them - I suspect 'Fry, like myself, has a slightly
different perpective because we are talking 'all breeds' and not only
highly reactive GSDs.

 

Slam, therin lies the rub. It is very hard to control WHERE a dog looks on a regular collar. You have control of the neck, not the head itself. The Halti and similar head collars provide that control of the head. With a regular collar, you either have to get the dog so interested in a ball or treats that it won't look away, or use a shock collar or prong and punish the dog every time its attention strays from you. If you have a dog that always focuses VERY VERY intently on other dogs, you are in for a long, hard, haul. Something that forces the dog to turn its head towards the handler, in my thinking, would really give you a step up in reaching your goal, and reduce the amount of punishment needed.

As for it injuring the neck, I don't see that happening when walking at heel as the dog will never be far enough away from the handler. This is not the sort of dog you're going to be giving the full length of the leash to!  If the dog were tied out on a Halti on a long line or chain, and lunged the full length of the tieout, then, yes, it could hurt its neck severely. But this type of collar is not meant for tying a dog out.

BTW, I saw a video the other day of someone teaching the focused heel by forcing the dog's head towards them with their left hand. If the dog fought them, they jerked several times on the leash/prong collar.    The dog must have been on a very tight leash to start with, in order for his head to stay in a position where the man could reach it with his hand without crouching. The pressure from the leash was also being used to haul the dog's front end up, and give it that fancy, prancing gait that's popular right now in the schutzhund obedience trial.

Not the sort of training I'd want to copy, thank you!

Two popular head-collars in the UK are the GenCon-All-In-One and the Canny Collar.

I used the C/Collar on my GSD for a short while when she was on restricted exercise, after trying a Halti and a Gentle Leader and I preferred the concept of how the CC worked as control was from behind the head and my dog accepted it far more readily.

I did try using a GenCon also, but she didn't accept that very well and fought it.  As the GenCon fits all sizes I tried walking my Border Collie on it and he walked beautifully with it on. I use neither now as both were only 'stop gaps'  but for aggressiveness rather than pulling I'd say the GenCon would be better.


GenCon



Canny Collar