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by HighDesertGSD on 21 September 2012 - 20:09
There are some vets who insist on getting P test past 2.0 ng/ml.
From many sources I read, the P rise to 2.0 ng/ml is the more reliable, or at least the same, as in ovulation timing. That is, LH surge occurs more reliably at 2.0 than ovulation starts at 5.0.
I am beginning to think that the practice of P test past 2.0 mg/ml is not necessary. It is better to test a couple of days early to get the LH surge (and count 2 days) than doing more P test after the arbitrary 5.0 for ovulation.
From many sources I read, the P rise to 2.0 ng/ml is the more reliable, or at least the same, as in ovulation timing. That is, LH surge occurs more reliably at 2.0 than ovulation starts at 5.0.
I am beginning to think that the practice of P test past 2.0 mg/ml is not necessary. It is better to test a couple of days early to get the LH surge (and count 2 days) than doing more P test after the arbitrary 5.0 for ovulation.
by HighDesertGSD on 21 September 2012 - 23:09
I went see a Dr Popkin in Santa Rosa CA.
He expressed his belief in P=2.0 ng/ml as the decisive and telling reading in P tests, all others readings are more chancy and less accurate. P=2.0 for LH surge varies the least among dogs.
The error made in using P=5 as ovulation is likely less than a day, however, a half day may be.
I think the difference is the needless costs in more P-tests than necessary.
He expressed his belief in P=2.0 ng/ml as the decisive and telling reading in P tests, all others readings are more chancy and less accurate. P=2.0 for LH surge varies the least among dogs.
The error made in using P=5 as ovulation is likely less than a day, however, a half day may be.
I think the difference is the needless costs in more P-tests than necessary.
by dogshome9 on 22 September 2012 - 00:09
I would need to check the difference (I am in Australia and we use the nmol/) and I had a bitch mated yesterday 2 days after a progesterone level of 15 nmol/ the rise to 15 is ovulation.
Fingers xxxxx for puppies in 9 weeks.
Fingers xxxxx for puppies in 9 weeks.
by Blitzen on 22 September 2012 - 02:09
If you're using frozen semen, it will only live for 12 hours after being thawed, so the bitch should be implanted at P=5. Live semen will be viable for up to 48 hours, so there is a bigger window both before and after the bitch ovulates. If the male is experienced, he is usually the best judge of when and where LOL.
by guddu on 22 September 2012 - 11:09
15 nmol/L=4.7 ng/mL Prog
by HighDesertGSD on 27 September 2012 - 22:09
the ratio is 3.18
"If you're using frozen semen, it will only live for 12 hours after being thawed, so the bitch should be implanted at P=5. Live semen will be viable for up to 48 hours, so there is a bigger window both before and after the bitch ovulates. If the male is experienced, he is usually the best judge of when and where LOL."
P= 5 ng/ml is far too early for Surgical AI with frozen semen. P=5 is more likely ovulation or about half to one day after ovulation. I have not read any article that suggest such an early day. Best time for surgical AI with frozen is 3 days after ovulation, which for most female is more than 5, more like 15.
Is Popkin is correct, all P readings after about 2.0 ng/ml is less accurate in indicating day of ovulation; the farther along the greater the number the less accurate in indicating date of ovulation.
Few vets will state that reading after 5 is strongly indicative, just that some state that 5 is the most indicative.
.
"If you're using frozen semen, it will only live for 12 hours after being thawed, so the bitch should be implanted at P=5. Live semen will be viable for up to 48 hours, so there is a bigger window both before and after the bitch ovulates. If the male is experienced, he is usually the best judge of when and where LOL."
P= 5 ng/ml is far too early for Surgical AI with frozen semen. P=5 is more likely ovulation or about half to one day after ovulation. I have not read any article that suggest such an early day. Best time for surgical AI with frozen is 3 days after ovulation, which for most female is more than 5, more like 15.
Is Popkin is correct, all P readings after about 2.0 ng/ml is less accurate in indicating day of ovulation; the farther along the greater the number the less accurate in indicating date of ovulation.
Few vets will state that reading after 5 is strongly indicative, just that some state that 5 is the most indicative.
.
by HighDesertGSD on 27 September 2012 - 22:09
The best day for Surgical AI with frozen semen is hence 5 days after P=2.0 ng/ml or 3 days after ovulation.
If you have enough faith you can stop testing after P=2.0 even for surgical AI with frozen; you just count five days.
Say if you do another test after 3 days and get 6.0, what can you do with this number? Do you trust 2.0 more than 6.0?
5 days after 2.0 or 3 days after 6.0, which many say is day of ovulation?
I think I will still use 5 days after 2.0, I tend to think, so I would not do another test and will stop at 2.0 and count. Takes some strength in belief!
If you have enough faith you can stop testing after P=2.0 even for surgical AI with frozen; you just count five days.
Say if you do another test after 3 days and get 6.0, what can you do with this number? Do you trust 2.0 more than 6.0?
5 days after 2.0 or 3 days after 6.0, which many say is day of ovulation?
I think I will still use 5 days after 2.0, I tend to think, so I would not do another test and will stop at 2.0 and count. Takes some strength in belief!
by northwoodsGSD on 29 September 2012 - 15:09
I use to test until 5.0ng was reached, then set up the mating days. With my current female it caused us to miss completely though... I now test to 2.0ng then base mating days on that. Knock on wood it's worked without a hitch! It also saves on the running to/from the vet & extra days of testing.
by shraza6719 on 12 October 2012 - 05:10
My female is in heat (season), on her 8th day of cycle her progesterone level was 1.77ng/ml n she had successful mating, on 10th day (yesterday) her progesterone was 4.08ng/ml and had a mating again. Now should i go for another progesterone test or go directly for mating again, today or tomorrow?????
by wanderer on 14 October 2012 - 07:10
My female was bred via surgical insem with frozen semen on the third day after P=15 nmol/L, the scale that is used in Canada. Prior to anaesthetizing her the vet actually called a reproductive specialist in Guelph to confirm that we were doing it on the right day and the specialist concurred. Sorry, don't know his name.
Wil not know for a couple of weeks if the breeding took.
Wil not know for a couple of weeks if the breeding took.
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