Crating and spinning dogs? - Page 1

We got we our boy a year ago this past February.  From the very first day we got him, He has always had a very bad habit of spinning like a top in his kennel. At night he is in a 6x8 indoor kennel. During the day he is out in the kennel yard which is a 30x50 yard.  When we enter the kennel building to let him out, he begins to spin.  We do not open his kennel door until he stops.  Since we got him, his spinning has seem to slow down some but he still does it.   We were told the the first owner kept him in a 400 crate till she sold at 5 months old.  The person she sold or placed, (since we can't get the real story), him to use to keep him in a crate also in a van over night till she could let him out.  That went on until the time we got him at 1 yr old.  These things we found out about 8mos after we got him. Regardless we would have still gotten dog as he he is an awesome boy.  

Just recently I was speaking to a breeder and was talking about this dog and his spinning issue.  The first thing she asked me was if we ever kept him in a crate for a long period of time.  Since he has been with us he has NEVER been kept in a crate unless we were traveling with him. That is it, and most of the time he is riding like a king in the back of the explorer.  She told me that dogs that are kept in crates alot have a tendency to do that.  I had been thinking about that and thought about what we had found out about our dog's former 2 owners and the way he was kept.  

My question is, has anyone ever experienced or know if there is any truth to this?  I would greatly apppreicate any input or experiences anyone wants to share.

i have had a spinner before and he did spin, i think it is partly to do with a crate but also to do with excitement and not burning off his energy, it took me a long time to get him out of it but it can be done as he gets older his enery level should slow down a little. you are doing the right thing and not letting him out till he calms down. i also had a spinner when the dog got excited to go outside from in the house so i just walk her out holding her collar so she cant spin, as i dont  like that behavior,she has done well. she was an import from germany and i know she had alot of kennel time as i can tell.

Hi, don't worry, some dogs spin  themselves around  when they are happy and excited. I have one who is very funny to see .

I dont' believe it has anything to do with crates, but there is a genetic predisposition to it.  I fostered a SL that was a spinner, only spinner I've ever had and I crate all my dogs. He was 12 weeks old when I got him, so I can not attribute over crating to his spinning.

Some dogs will grow out of it if you keep them busy (which he did) and others never do without serious work.

Absolutely has to do with time in a crate. 

Look at a litter of ten pups and 2 of them spin. Same two happen to be in so-called "working homes" where they are crated except for short potty breaks and Sunday training. They spin and scream and dig furiously at the crate when you come to let them out. The others, crate trained in the normal fashion (when you're not home or overnight) never do it and are fairly calm (just excited) when you go to let them out. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out when someone is lying about the time the dog spent in a crate. I've seen firsthand that a lot of lying goes on about how much time some people's dogs really spend in a crate. 

I have taken in a few dogs like this and the neurotic behavior lessens as time goes on. Sometimes they stop completely. I like to leave those dogs loose as much as possible and sort of "decompress" for a while. 

I have 2 yorkies and a Bedlington that I got from the same breeder . They spent a lot of time in crates before I got them. The spinning was horrible when I first got them. It has been years since I got them, the two yorkies have slowed down their spin cycle but they will still walk round and round the coffee table. The Bedlington, well he was rescued, his spinning is RIDICULES. He can't go three steps without 5-6 twirls . That is from literally years of living in a crate. Some breeders just really suck, this guy was def in it for the money, not a care or thought in the world for his dogs. Otis, the Bedlington now lives with my mother. Not crated ever, with a huge fenced yard. And four years later, he still spins out of control!

Jenni78, I think you hit it right on!!  You mentioned the "working home" scenario.  Both homes he was in before we got him were supposed to be "schutzhund homes". The first one owned a dog that was titled, but she bought it already titled,  and the other one is a trainer.  However they both belong to the same "Club".  This same dog also has a bad habit of attacking the water hose. It was cute as a puppy but could be dangerous as an adult since he is a hefty 95# of dog which consist of big heavy bone, huge head and muscle, not fat.  Thank God he is not fat.  But anyway, the more I think about it, the more I think it has alot to do with the time a dog spends in a crate.  I was never told by those two people how the dog was constantly crated until after several months we had gotten him, and it was told by another member of the same "training club" they belong to.  

But anyway, back to the OP, I do believe now after thinking it over and watching his behavior, that it definitely could be related to be crated all the time.  I have apretty good relationship with his breeder and she said that none of the other pups in his litter does that. She also said none of the other puppies were sold to schutzhund homes. They were sold to families, personal protection homes and 
a police officer bought two of them. None of them are spinners, but none of them were raised in a crate.

Thanks for the opinions, I would love to hear more if anyone wants to share their opinions with us.

I have a girl who does this and I do not crate her. She was crated all day from her previous owner and only allowed out itno a tiny yard for about an hour a day. Now when she is not out on the property, she is in a 12x24 run and she paces in large circles ALL day. She will not stop and rest at all. When I let her out, she is required to stay calm before she gets out. When I first got her, she spun crazily in circles any time I came near her kennel/run. When she comes out, she runs about for about 1/2 hour and then sleeps the rest of the time! She is a fantastic dog in every other way and I know that the crate situation damadged her. I have had her for 2 years now and the spinning has stopped but the pacing has not. She is not a hyper type dog when she is out. She is actually a calm girl. Just crate damadged.  There is a right way and wrong way to use  those things. I personally do not use them anymore.

Spinning can be created by improper use of crates. However, there are dogs that will develop a spinning behavior without ever being exposed to crates. Certain breeds are predisposed to these types of compulsive behaviors. In this case though, I would agree that your dog's spinning behavior was likely created by previous owners.

It can't be pinned on a single factor, not just the crate and the amount of time in it, it also depends on the dog.  Environment and genetics both, Nature AND Nurture.