Mycoplasma/Stud Refund - Page 1

Looking for advice....

Should My Stud Fee Be Refunded:

Bred my female did all necessary tests prior to breeding she tested "NEGATIVE" for Brucellosis, Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma.  This particular stud is only the second stud she has been bred to in her lifetime.  She has produced 3 live litters in her breeding career this would have been litter #4.  No history of fertility issues.  Also did progesterone prior to breeding.  Pregnancy did not take, no pups produced.

Stud owner allowed me a repeat breeding, next heat same stud same female.  Female was place on Orbax 7 days prior to breeding as precautionary measures.  Again, pregnancy did not take, no pups produced.

Stud owner allowed me a repeat breeding, same stud this time I leased a female (from a friend I knew the female so felt confident she would produce).  No history of fertility issues, has produced 5 live litters.  This female was also tested for Brucellosis, Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma and she as well came back "NEGATIVE" so we proceeded with the breeding.  Again, pregnancy did not take, no pups produced.

This was then the end of breeding to this male, I asked the owner of the stud for a refund and she said "NO", that she had already allowed me one extra breeding??

Six months come around and I am preparing to again breed the 1st female (not to stud above) after having her Thyroid tested which came back "NORMAL" and again testing her for Brucellosis, Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma, but this time she comes back "POSITIVE" for Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma which she has never had, so another missed breeding.

Second female has come into heat, we prepare to breed her again (not to stud above) and again testing her for Brucellosis, Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma, but this time she ALSO comes back "POSITIVE" for Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma which she also has never had, so another missed breeding.

I do also remember the stud having difficulty "tying" as if he was not interested, progesterone testing confirmed these females were ovulating by progesterone draws and vaginal smears.  I know that Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma are normal inhabitant of the female reproductive tract and probably would not be asking for this refund if breeding had been attempted on two different females (3) different times that have produced between the two of them 8 healthy litters.

I know there are not refunds in the "stud" world but it angers me managing a stud dog should be given as much attention and priority as preparing the bitch.  Mycoplasma is one of the leading causes of spontaneous abortion in canines and infertility.  

This particular contract read:   
"You are allowed 1 repeat stud service when a bitch has failed to conceive or has not had at least 2 live puppies"  No where does it state "NO REFUNDS"  in addition to the contract is attached a Brucellosis test on this particular stud, but it is dated one year prior to when we bred, so not a recent test.

So, am I out of line again asking for a refund after all the tests could have possibly proven that both these two females could have contracted something "Mycoplasma/Ureaplasma" from this particular male????

Thank you.....

I honestly think this breeder needs to man up and either give you a refund or give you a stud that can produce. you payed  this breeder for getting some pups and that what you should get , even if its a small litter.

this stud probly has a very bad case of Mycoplasma and should be tested for this, well i hope you told her to get him tested. 

i myself test all my breeding stock for mycoplasma and brucella , its the right thing to do.

good luck

First: does stud owner have microscope that can check a smear after tie to show live sperm,is the best way to avoid ,female owners wondering....has this stud produce any litters or been bred during your struggle to get yours pregnant?".......unless you can prove that stud has no live sperm, I don't think you deserve a refund,sorry....if it was your stud,what would you do?

    If it were my stud, by all means if my contract guaranteed "two live puppies" you better believe I would give a refund.  Just  like all the people I had on my waiting list for all these missed breedings triple what the stud fee was, were all refunded by me.  Just like I and many other breeders stand behind their "puppy" guarantees, why then should the stud owners not be expected to adhere to rules and guidelines other than simply stating "I will guarantee two live pups" and still not even stand by that!  

Its not about live sperm, (in a sense)  its about having tests that showed two fertile females that ended up with an infection that did not have prior to being bred.  

Its about "large breeders" not stepping up to the plate and testing their dogs and thinking a brucellosis test one year prior to breeding will suffice.  Incoming females must be tested so should the males on some level and proof  should be provided the male was tested.  If the male is in business to produce then the stud owner should take responsibility to make sure he has live sperm before breeding, maybe this is what you meant I don't know.  Its about accountability!  Do you think anyone will be honest about this NO, that's the bottom line.  I have lab results  prove my argument.  Litters produced I am not sure she says he has but how do I know? credibility at this point is out the window...   Some may agree with me and many will not, its about being honest but most are purely in it for the money, its just not ethical, just sayin......   Thank you for your response it is helpful and I do appreciate it.

I found this while searching for Mycoplasma. Very interesting article. It says Mycoplasma is always found in the vaginal track as well as multiple other bacteria and does not cause infertility.

http://www.hilltopanimalhospital.com/vaginalculture.htm

This vet says otherwise.
http://www.akc.org/vetoutreach/headlinenews_14.cfm

GSDRezQ  Thank you ...
I am aware that these bacteria's are normal inhabitant of the female reproductive tract.  But why three breedings in a row with the same male? out of two perfectly fertile/clean bitches??? guess there is really no way to prove, perhaps I will change my agenda and not produce pups but just have "studs" no obligations, no accountability, just seems so much easier than rearing  puppies? 

Again, I ask why should the owners of the stud not be obligated to perform routine testing on their males??   The unknown I guess... 

We are assuming you did everything correct, check for cornification and progesterone. I do a lot of breedings and many times breeders want to go by " this is her regular cycle" ...if there is any infection on the male,even worst brucella, there wouldn't be any live sperm,that is why. I just did a breeding, after the tie,I put a slide under the females' vagina and look in the microscope: millions. It sounds like you did everything properly,...did you put Vaseline in the vagina to help the male tie?...was female still cornified after the last breeding?........did the male have other litters around those times yours missed?

I do testing,but not every time I breed nor every month.......again,with any infection,sperm will not be viable, that's why I check with a slide after breeding and show the female's owner so he can see there is live sperm.........but you are right,you can request the stud owner for some tests,I guess,after you missed so many....

I would be very upset that you did everything required and it doesnt sound like the stud dog owner did. Depending on what you paid for the stud fee, you could consider small claims court. The fact that both bitches tested positive after being bred, I would seek reimbursement. The only problem you will have is how much time has passed since they were bred. This may have been harder to prove but the fact that you had 2 separate bitches and both failed to get pregnant AND both turned up positive shows things are not right.

If I were you, Id be seeking reimbursement.