4 month old pup photo needs assessment - Page 1

This pup came to our home for boarding today. 

  The breeder told the owner, he would "grow out of this", and to use dog food with 21% protein, get him on Calcium and Fish oil tabs, and get him on a worming treatment!   I was naucious even before I picked him up.   His rear legs in action flop all over the place, and you can see the front and rear deformities from this photo.   
After I take him home, she is interested in my opinion and hope to give her the most information I can gather about him,  the love of her life.  I'll sit her down for my findings.

Southern California Breeder, whoeveryou are, you ought to be so ashamed of yourself.    No food, supplimentation, worming meds, or magic orthepedic pixie dust is going to help this obvious birth defect in my opinion,  but I am willing to learn anything I can to help my guest here.

.  Any opinions regarding this are welcome!   The owner will certainly want to start with  X-rays and a full blood panel run to see if there there is any auto-immune or degenerative situation present.    So sad, she may have started looking into the situation if the Breeder hadn't convinced her that no X rays were needed, and all the other mis-information he dealt her.   Thanks for your thoughts, ideas and prayers regarding Sir Winston here.

I dont know what is wrong with this poor puppy, but just anyone could say this poor thing is sick or something is for sure wrong with him.

Is this pup active? can he even walk?  I feel sorry for him and his owner. I hope this can be fix and also that it is not an expesive process.

 This looks like a birth defect not a suplementation or food issue IMHO. This poor guy shaould have been culled. This dog is walking on his hocks for pete's sake man what is wrong with people???!!! 

Honestly, I don't think there is a whole lot you can do for this.  The Tendon and Ligaments are extremely week.  Most times the best way to help Strengthen this is exercise, though it is not a cure, but can help.

I wouldn't be quick to start throwing vitamins and  pills at the puppy with out making sure it remains balanced.
 
You can cause more damage by an imbalance of Calcium/Phosphorus ratios.  And while fish oil is great for immune and coat and some arthritis issues, it doesn't do much for Tendons and ligaments. 
Though, it won't hurt to use it for preventative counter athritis pain, that this pup is likely to have as he matures.

If I were to deal with this , I would make sure that the puppy is not overfed, to make sure he doesn't have and extra burden on the pasterns and hocks as he matures.  There may be the potential to have surgery on the Tendons and Ligaments to tighten them.   That is something You would want to consult a Vet. about.  The question I would ask the vet  would be "  How much time do I allow the puppy to exercise and see how much he can strengthen the pasterns and hocks ,before we make a decision about surgery ?"  If surgery is even an option at this age.  What is the best case scenario if I do or don't do the surgery, and worst case scenario if I do or don't do the surgery.   

Sometimes it is best to do it while they are young and the Tendons and Ligaments have a better chance to heal and still develope properly.   Tend. and Ligs are not the best tissue to mess with, they don't heal  and repair ideal, like other soft tissue. 

Sometimes you can cause more problems and spend a whole lot of money trying to fix something that is not really fixable.

Not sure I helped much but good luck . 

Okay, I am guessing this dog is an American showline, right? This is not unusual with them, and the pup COULD possibly grow out of it. They deliberately SELECT for loose ligaments, as it gives the dog a flashier gait. I'm not exactly sure how this works, but I think it has to do with allowing more reach, and the hocks to land flat on the ground when the dog is trotting.

But,. yeah, if I were your friend, I'd take him back. THis is extreme even for an American showline.

Here's another example. This dog actually has its UKC championship! 





More photos: you can see how the pasterns have grown stronger as the dog has matured:

eclipsekennels.com/GSD/bubby.htm

This is covered in Fred Lanting's book - Canine Hip Dysplasia and Other Orthopedic Disorders

Corpal Luxaton (CSS) And Hock Luxation
page 424

I recommend this book for anyone who is serious about breeding, raising, showing and trailing dogs. It has a wealth of information.

Dietary changes can help - low protein diet, less calcium and phosphorus - but still at the same recommended ratio.  - No added meat, eggs, cheese.... they all rich in protein, calcium and phosphorus. If dog is eating a good kibble, add buttered noodles or rice to reduce the percentage of protein.

Mild cases have moderate cases have responded to magnesium supplementation - if carefully monitored - ask your vet about this.

Its been seen in puppies being fed anything from cheap low protein feeds to super premium feeds, raw and home cooked also. GSDCA sees that high energy, high protein feeds could make it worse.

Puppy needs to be given free access on sand, soft gravel and grass surfaces - especially before 4 months of age.

Also check thyroid it could play a roll.

This is a genetic disorder and even if the puppy improves, it should be sterilized.

Use some Vet wrap and loosley wrap over the wrist area ( hopefully he won't chew it off) but it will help support those loose ligaments. Every once in a while Humans are born with extreamly loose ligaments, where they can bend there wrists this way and that, and there fingers all the way back. It happens in horses, in dogs and other animals.  If this where my puppy I would NOT give calcium supplements. I would be giving high dosages of Vita C, NuVet wafers, good food and be supporting those legs with a light wrap. Its going to take 2-3 months to grow out of this, as he gets out of the funny teen long leg stage it should get much better.

Whisper

Sunsilver -
I'm sure you agree,  this dog becoming a champion is exactly what is wrong with breeding and showing dogs only for that "flying gait" .......and for a judge to select a dog with such deformities is pathetic!

Heart breaking!  Poor pup.  I have no idea how to fix it.  Just heart breaking.