Puppy bitework question - Page 1

Hello,

I have a question regarding puppy or even adult bitework. What is the look a puppy (4-6months) or an adult should have during protection or biting phase in trials or in general for that matter?
 
What I mean is I was looking at a couple of puppy rag work videos and after a few views I noticed that one of the puppies had its hair raised on its back and ears back while the puppy in the other video did not?

Should this even be questioned at the puppy age? How about the adult age? By the way I am referring to a puppy wanted for competitive schutzhund trailing etc....(this added in edit) Which puppy would be considered the better prospect?

I appreciate you taking the time to help me with this inquiry.

Sincerely,

Joseph

While some dogs hackle up in excitement, it usually means the puppy is a bit defensive, which isn't very desirable at a very young age. A good helper can balance the puppy.

In an adult, defensiveness isn't necessarily a bad thing but the dog should be confident enough to not hackle up. Again, in a good dog, with a good trainer, it can be resolved.

Thank you KCzaja for your response so even though hair raised and ears back is less desirable it isnt necessarily something that would make you prefer the pup who didnt have the raised hair and ears laid back?

Thanks again,

Joseph

I, personally,would RUN away from a pup who raises its hackles if being worked with a rag (in prey) at that,  or any age. It's fearful.  Having not seen the vid, I don't know if the decoy is foolishly scaring the pup? I mean, it *could* be done, by someone inexperienced or plain dumb.

Hackles mean fear. It is a defense mechanisim (sp?) to make the animal look bigger in an effort to scare away the perceived threat. It is GENERALLY always followed by flight behavior if NOT restricted by a  leash.   

Thank you Nocurs for your response as well. What you said is what I was thinking in regards to the pup being afraid and no the helper was not scaring the pup at all. It was simply the pups natural response.

I appreciate your input. Once I noticed the difference in the 2 pup videos I thought I had better question it here since I wasnt certain.

Thanks again,

Joseph

I just reviewed the videos again and actually during the" rag tease" and grabbing /biting the rag their is no issue with hair on the pups back raised etc but when the puppy is off leash and running and then leaping a couple feet to bite the rag then the hair raises. Not sure if that makes a difference but that is exactly what is on the video but again the other pups hair does not rise nor are her ears laid back while doing the same work/training.

Thanks again,

Joseph

Well, it makes sense. The pup was asked to do something "more", something it was not as confident with, so the hair came up to show you that inside t he pup was thinking "oh crap! I want to do this, but it is kinda scaring me!"  

Can you link the videos?

KCzaja,

I sent you a PM in regards to the videos since I simply want a general question answered and am not trying to create any controversy regarding the breeders or anyone else. Respectfully I just want to know generally is the above in my OP a usual or normal response in puppy bitework training.

Thanks again everyone who replied. I do appreciate it. I look forward to other views as well if any.

Sincerely,

Joseph

Hackles raised is an adrenaline response. It can mean fear, excitement, or being in a situation they know is dangerous but staying anyways.

I can elicit the response in one of my adults by NOT playing ball with her for a few weeks, then showing her the ball. It has nothing to do with defense, it is excitement. She will hackle up as she is chasing the ball down and smooth out on return, then repeat.

I have seen puppies that hackled up while chasing their rag on a flirt pole. It had nothing to do with confidence, fear etc... It was excitement. Those puppies went on to be confident, hard working adults.

That is not to say the same is happening in your video as we have not seen the video so we are guessing.

Melissa