Stud Fee Puppy - Gaurantee? - Page 1

I'm curious, for those people who give the stud dog owner a stud fee puppy, do you also give with that pup the same guarantees that you would give with a pup you sold to someone?

And if you are the stud dog owner who is getting a puppy as a stud fee, would you expect the same guarantees on the puppy as the breeder gives with their other pups?

And what is your rationale behind your stance?

Actually while we are on the subject of gaurantees, do people consider a guarantee transferable? IE if you sell a pup to someone, and they resale it to someone else, if there is a genetic problem with the dog down the line, who has a responsibility to the final owner? The original breeder, or the person who sold them the dog? This could be a situation where someone took a stud fee puppy then resold it, or it could be a situation where a breeder sold a pup who was then resold.

I can not comment on the stud fee situation, as I do not as of this time own a stud dog....However, I always pay a stud fee upfront, that way there is less room for miscommunication, and disagreements.....Not only that, this way I don't have to give pick of the litter......

About the warranty on puppies we sell, the warranty is transferable...Just because the puppy changes hands doesn't change the genetic makeup of the puppy.....Of course the entire conditions of the contract applies also....

 If I had a bitch bred and paid fees by giving the stud owner a puppy I wouldn't provide a guarantee, if a genetic problem arises it could be from the stud not the bitch, chances are equal, it would be unfair to give a guarantee. JMO, I have no previous personal experience though. 
Ibrahim

I don't take a puppy instead of stud fee - and if I were a female owner, I wouldn't give one - the puppy is worth much more than the stud fee for one thing, for another, the question about "what ifs" something happens with the puppy - will it be resold, who guarantees it if it is resold.... too many "what ifs". 

My contract/guarantee does not transfer - this is clear and written in my contract, anyway also in the contract is my first right of refusal if the owner does choose not to keep the puppy.  I do not sell puppies to agents anyway.

molly

no, I would not give a guarantee with a stud fee pup. This is essentially a co-breeding in which the owner of the male has agreed to accept a pup for his dog's service. They come and pick the one they want and that is the end of the contract.

I agree with Molly, I would never give up the pick puppy for a stud fee, unless I expected it to be a very mediocre breeding. You can spend your life trying to breed a spectacular pup, no way I'm watching it ride off down the road.

Rik

Rik,
Thats why I always pay the stud fee instead of giving up the pick puppy....If stud owner likes the breeding that much that he wants a puppy, than the stud fee can be applied to the purchase price of a puppy. Than  after I make my pick, the stud owner can pick his puppy....

the puppy is worth much more than the stud fee for one thing

I think this is a GSD thing, in the Malinois the rule of thumb for a stud fee is the price of a puppy.  That also seems to be the case in other breeds, at least that's the info I get from breeders I talk to.

Personally if I want to keep a pup from a litter, I keep my pick, end of discussion.  If I am doing a stud fee puppy, and I have a few times but only to fellow trainers I know well, the stud dog owner can pick after I pick.  Which would be the same thing I would do if they were purchasing the pup, since they have almost as much interest in the litter as I do, owning the sire, I'd give them second pick if they wanted to buy it.

nice topic kadi!

 Where i'm from it's common for the stud owner to ask for up 2 pups in return for the stud if she has over six, 2nd and 4th pick. 1st pick is out of the question. I think the stud owner has a right to a puppy though, like Ibrahim said, half of the litter's genes belong to the stud. At other times they may just ask for the money form a pup being sold. 

This is a great topic.....

I believe that if a set stud fee is not paid because the stud owner wants the value of  the money from the sale of the first pup sold, than I think that the stud owner should  take second pick pup and sell it themselves......Why should the breeder have to sell it for stud owner......

I also do not think that the breeder should warranty the puppy should the stud owner take a puppy, since the stud owner has as much responsibility as the breeder concerning the health and genetics of the litter...JMO..