What defines Courage in a dog? - Page 1

Courage: the quality of mind or spirit that enables a person to face difficulty, danger, pain, etc., without fear; bravery.

Can this be used as a definition for a dog? You can train a dog to fight to do visually heroic feats but are they brave? are they truly self sacrificing? or well taught? I know what my thoughts are on this but I have read many people who say " The dog shows bravery on the field" Which I don,t believe is bravery but using the natural instincts of a dog to develop a desired reaction.  

When I say I don,t believe on the trial field (and I include Mondio,PSA, ect...) dogs are not showing bravery they are showing willingness to engage,endure,fight or run.

Approximately 6 years ago I had a very calm & peaceful shepherded who never attacked a human & / or even his natural enemy "cats". I never trained him for protection but he was very obedient.

However one day we were on the beach & my son was attacked by a couple of children who were older than him. The surprise was when prince saw this situation he immediately & with no hesitation attacked the 2 attackers & showed unexpected aggression that surprised everybody. The 2 boys just ran away in horror with one of them badly injured.

I call this bravery.

 This is a very difficult subject and too complicated and I know I am one of the least knowledgabe here on these issues but I have a contribution here if the more knowledgable allow me:
Dog played a big role in the life of desert people in our countries and the old people have wise saying, some of them are about dogs, they say (I will translate best I can):
Dog is no man, dog serves and pleases man, dog acts in accordance to his rank in pack or dog acts as much as he desires to please his man.
Which means a dog will fight if his rank in his pack is high to protect his rank, or he fights to please his master, the more he likes to please the more he would do. So a dog with no master and low rank in pack will not feel the need to fight.

Ibrahim

So the natural instinct to protect a bonded pack member is brave ?, I,m not disagreeing, your dog sounds like a dog worth it,s salt to me.   But if the dog saw a old man on the beach being attacked by a knife wielding thug do you think your dog would attempt to intervene or am I implying a human emotion to a k9?.

So is it Courage to place anothers well being above it own? or is it impossible for a dog to have that thought pattern?.

    

    Bob....Does Rin Tin Tin ring a bell..???? What about Lassie...Hmmmmm...lol...

        Nice story Tarekallam.....

I would change the definition just a little, since a dog and a person are mentally different (ie I can tell a person a gun is dangerous, they don't have to experience it.  The dog hears blah blah blah blah)

Courage: the quality of mind or spirit that enables a person to RECOGNIZE and face difficulty, danger, pain, etc., 

I don't think fear has to be absent to show courage, actually I think in some cases the existance of fear is part of what defines courage.  IE the person, or dog, recognizes they are in danger, can be hurt, etc and still fights.  

Is a dog running down field towards someone firing a gun, who has never in their life experience anything other than blanks in a gun, showing courage?  I don't think so.  What is courageous about running towards something that has never been a negative in any way?

Is a dog running down field towards someone firing a gun, who has previously been shot by a gun, showing courage?  Probably.  Because that dog understands, through experience, what can be associated with that sound.

I also believe dogs are capable of self sacrifice.  Think about a momma dog who takes on a much larger/stronger adversary, something they would normally run from, to protect their pups.  They know they are putting themselves in harms way, but are doing it to protect their pups, to the point of dying if needed.  In some cases that behavior can/will be extended towards a human or other dog.

My next door Greek lady neighbor who lives with her old sick mother has a very peaceful 8 years old Labrador that even gets frightened from my Jack Russel Milo.

6 months earlier a thief broke into their house & stole some precious things & left with our 8 years old friend did not even bark. Later on & after the police had investigated the incident the thief was just her maid whom the dog knows well.

Last week the same dog viciously attacked a delivery man who was trying to steal a valuable figure whilst my neighbor went in to get him the money for what he brought her. The dog caught the delivery man with the figure in his hand.

This is another story about a dog that had never received any protection training whatsoever.

I think protection is built in dogs that receive good care from their owners & treated as heroes by the family.

I think the more you show your dog that you are proud of him & praise him for any good actions that he does, he would protect you with no hesitation to be praised by you and to show that he deserves your good treatment. The more you make him feel that he is part of the family the more protection he would give to the family.

I would define courage the way some people define hardness in a dog.

IE:  A dog who can take a correction, sometimes an extremely traumatizing event and recover from the event and continue to do their job.

For a broad example, say you had a guide dog who experienced being hit by a car.  If that dog recovered from that event and returned to do his job 'leading his person in and out of cars, buses, etc' without cowering away from this giant metal monster who hurt him/her I would call that courageous in a dog.

What is done on the trial field, while spectacular is 99.9% of the time a trained behavior.

I think the words "courage and bravery" being attributed to a dog is a human's perception and the words that they use to describe it -- not what is going on in the dog's mind.   In the case that Tarek described, his dog saw a member of HIS (the dog's) family -- or pack, if you will -- being harmed.   The dog engaged because he is bonded to his family.   In the case of an old man being attacked by others with a knife -- they are strangers to the dog.   The dog may engage just because of getting agitated from the shouting/scuffling going on.  However, he may bite the victim or perpetrator or both -- he doesn't know them nor who is the "good guy" or the "bad guy."   JMO