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by royalvalley on 02 August 2005 - 22:08
I am looking for offspring or grand offspring of this dog
by PINERIDGE on 02 August 2005 - 23:08
Why? -- This dog is from 20 years ago. Huhnegrab has many nice dogs in this decade -- I see lots of them in Canada, if I'm not mistken. If there was a son of his born when he was 10 and that dog had a son/daughter when it was 10 -- that grandson of is would most likely not be breeding now - not to mention this dog (a very nice dog at that) would be farther in the background. I believe that your heritage is important, even if at some point those specific genes are not affecting the current generation - they are in there -- but I'd hate to see you get stuck on this one line exclusive of so many other good ones available today. Just a thought !! -- Hey, at least I didn't say "go read a book", eh ?
by JochenVGW on 03 August 2005 - 00:08
I'd be interested in knowing if there are any breeders keeping cliff's lines around as well. There are few, if any, showline dogs with his ability to work these days.
Certainly there are NO current showline dogs that have the working record that Cliff had (4x BSP). If there were a showline dog that had been in the top 10 in the BSP, I'd certainly recommend him, but they don't exist right now...
If the showline world was truly serious about keeping working ability alive, there would be more people looking for dogs like Cliff and his offspring for breeding.
Not to be argumentative, but I think Cliff was a pretty special dog, and a lot more unique than any of the current VA dogs I can think of
by LuvCzechDawgz on 03 August 2005 - 01:08
I agree. Cliff was very influential to working line dogs and one of the handful of "showline" dogs that could seriously work.
A few others VA dogs similar to Cliff are
Biernd Lierberg
Mutz vd Pelztierfarm
Anderl vom Kleinen Pfahl
by spaetzle on 03 August 2005 - 04:08
I personally think that huhnegrab is only because the breeder is a judge and he sells his dogs into the USA through breeders like JH. Heinz sells a lot of dogs through USA breeders like JH and then ensures high placements at the USA shows even though the dogs are not anything that they would dare to show in Germany.
It is a very wicked web we have woven.
by Silbersee on 03 August 2005 - 04:08
Spaetzle,
that is a pretty nasty accusation. Can you please back that up with a few examples?
I know and respect both JH and Heinz Scheerer and just can not imagine that.
Heinz has had some nice dogs throughout his breeding career and has always emphasized on a strong female line.
I have to say - anonymous or not, I would never ever make statements like that.
Chris
by spaetzle on 03 August 2005 - 04:08
Chris, no offense, but look for yourself to the results of 2005. Look as far south as North Carolina and then go North to New England. Anonymous or not I am not brain dead.
by LuvCzechDawgz on 03 August 2005 - 05:08
I'm not sure how this correlates with Cliff and how well he contributed to working GSDs past and present.
The results today have far less to do with Heinz but more to do with VA dogs lost after Cliff and some other great VA dogs. WORKABILITY
You can't make the focal point of your breeding program be red coats and masculine heads and expect it
to continue to have the same production as dogs up to the early 80's
JMO
by JochenVGW on 03 August 2005 - 17:08
Not sure of any others, but Alyeska GSD's in Alaska has a Cliff grandson. They might be able to point you in the right direction.
http://www.alaskagermanshepherds.com
by lhczth on 03 August 2005 - 19:08
This kennel, http://www.adlerstein.com/ , used Cliff when he was here and has him behind some of her dogs.
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