Protection - Page 1

Topic of the day:

Dirty in the blind

First off, I don't want this to turn into a war on what is acceptible and humane.

What methods do you use to correct the dirty dog?

Do you allow the helper to correct, why or why not?

I've seen more gimics and methods used in this exercise than there are uses for the Sham-wow.  Just curious what has worked for you and how you went about it. 

Are the dogs really dirty, or just think we are stupid to have them check empty blinds when they know where the bad guy is? On that thought, to me it is a matter of OB, becuse I believe they know and think we are dumb and out of respect will check the empty blinds. So it is only really fun if they check the empties first, then the reward.

I Have used a combination of methods and they have worked pretty well for me.  There  are certain helpers that I will have do corrections in the blind if I feel comfortable with them. Nate Harves had a pretty good diagram on one of his posts about helper corrections.  Otherwise i will often have a third person either correct the dog with a long line of electric collar.  I will often then calm the dog and praise proper behavior.  I have to be a bit careful because I am a larger corn fed kinda guy so I can if doing the correction myself make the dog more focused on me then the helper and that is not good.   But when multiple people work as a team it can work pretty well

Don. First thanks for trying. Hope you are the first and not the last. Now with the dirty I try to never to  let it happen. If a problem arises at the first sign we would take the work out of the blind. Depending upon the dog we would do what ever it takes to make them clean. Only when they are clear would we let them push us into the blind. They MUST feel all powerful and in control in the blind. It is not a spot where we want conflict as it is a judges first impression. I always try to make my enemy my friend in training.  I have found a lot of dogs are good until blinds are started and with so many runaway prey bites they become dirty. They usually have very little Obedience at that point. We have gone to post after blinds{foundation} before putting them together. If we ever meet you owe me a beer for that one.

My two girls are still learning though can get dirty at times.  We have used a long line to "feed" them into the blind, or stop them where they need to be.  They seem to be learning quickly.  Ccatti sometimes needs a reminder from the helper which is fine with a select number of helpers.

Animules. If you need the long line to feed them in there is conflict. More post work or work OUT of the blind should be done. The dog must feel control  before pushing the weak helper into the blind. We have found this to work but with strong dogs you always go back to post {foundation} when their attitudes rise.

Realcold has a good point we will also work outside the blind and then work gradually into it.  I also forgot in my earlier post that also if you are letting the helper correct the dog your dog should already have a good foundation and be clear.  For some dogs it may not be appropiate (the helper correction)

realcold
I don't owe you squat!  You owe me a 6 pack for starting a thread that exemplifies your brilliance and knowledge.

I have seen so many methods that this is actually a good thread.  I really don't want to know what methods you use, but why you use them.

Iv'e seen helpers drop the sleeve and walk out of the blind, helpers crack the dog with the stick, helpers shock the dog, helpers spit H2o in their face, helpers use a pull tab, a third party correct the dog, handler use electric,   handlers repeatidly call out and re-send,  work out of the blind, etc. etc. 

I guess I am looking for the reasoning.  Maybe it varies with each dog, but that is what I was looking for.

Don. I am out of town starting my young dog in protection so late to get back to. After rereading the thread I am in agreement with you. But I am truly generous so we will make it a poor mans case.(12 pack}

One of the best tools for this is the short round table.  When doing the foundation bitework the chain is short enough that the dog's feet do not hang over the edge and he cannot jump off.  This is basic tie out work for grip development just as many people do on the ground.

When the dog is ready to progress, lengthen the chain so that the dog can come off the table but not stand on the ground comfortably.  The handler is at the dogs side, standing on the table with him, to turn the dog on.  At this stage, most dogs will hit the end of the chain and come off the table.  Most of the time the dog will jump back up on the table and the helper throws the grip. 

Some dogs will not be affected by having two feet on the ground and one or two on the table and will stay focused on the barking.  When that happens, the handler directs the dog back on the table by lifting the chain and when he is back on the table the helper throws the grip.

Within a few times the dog will begin to hold himself at the end of the table with a slack line and barking just as if he was back tied.  This starts the foundation to clean guarding and without helper or handler corrections; the dog taught himself restraint.

Scott B