How Would You Handle This Situation - $2000 for Dog and NO Papers! - Page 7

Yes, the situtation is enough to make you want to hurl!  What's really bad is I'm a disabled veteran and it took me quite awhile to save up that much money and to then be taken advantage of that way makes me ill. I guess some people have no conscience.

MNGSDLUVR

                            From one veteran to another I feel real bad for your situation.  If you filed a complaint with the attorney generals office in North Carolina legally you have gone the extra mile.

Maybe it's time as another poster suggested to put the fear of God in BCoats.  There are quite a few able bodied veterans living in North Carolina maybe one of them will give you a helping hand.

MNGSLUVR I would like to thank you for your service to our country.We veterans stick together thru thick and thin. I'm sure one of our brothers will step up to the plate and lend you a helping hand.

I am so sorry to hear that.
I wouldn't be happy to pay that kind of money for a dog with mange. $100 maybe, but $2000, no.
If you could treat it and it went away, that's at least good. The red mange version doesn't go away-it is genetic.
Here's a potential concern...if the dog had mange when you got it, was/had he been on heartworm protection all this time prior to you getting him? I'm wondering because any Ivermectin-based heartworm prevention meds would usually kill/prevent mange from ever happening unless he came in direct contact with another dog/animal who had it. This doesn't mean he's not been on heartworm meds, but I would definitely be concerned.

As far as your paperwork...wow, what a bad situation. Has this dog ever been registered with the AKC? I would 1st off check to make sure (give them his full name and make sure no dog has been registered with the AKC under his paperwork/registration number you seem to have on your copy of the paperwork posted earlier).
Then, find a US-speaking contact with that kennel club registry that Lord is from, and tell them your situation(keep your English very plain-don't go into a lot of gibber or they may not understand you). Tell them you bought this dog, who you bought it from, now you can't get your rightful papers. Ask them what to do since he's from overseas.

If the person you bought him from belongs to a club like the WDA or USA or a training club, write the club president(s) and inform them of your experience. I'm sure they will wanna know. They may not be able to do much, but your story will at least then be known.

Then there's Small Claims court, but keep in mind Small Claims only awards $$$ up to $3000-a Magistrate doesn't have the power to tell someone to give you paperwork. You could sue for the amount paid for the dog and expect it UNLESS papers are provided for the dog I guess. But believe me, the court system is very strange and takes forever to settle issues. Your Attorney General might be better like already mentioned.

Who has this dog's papers?? If he's sold to you, why don't they give them up to you, whether they sold you the dog direct or not? Considering the circumstance, this person should've never been selling a dog for someone else, if this is how they handle business. Even tho the other person doesn't seem 'responsible', SOMEone has your boys' papers and isn't giving them to you. If the person holding his papers doesn't like it that he is sold, then that is their issue to take up with the person who sold him-not you. It could be you're not getting your papers because whoever had the dog previously hasn't been paid. MESSY MESSY dog situations! They never cease. 

What a dirty shame. You're right-some people don't have a conscience,especially when it comes to money. Not all breeders are this way, tho, MNGSD-I'm just very sorry you had to come across one who apparently is (now). It seems some breeders start out with the best of intentions, only to get power/praise-hungry, or money-hungry and then off on a tangent. They lose focus of what made their reputation in the first place-their passion and dedication to a marvelous breed.

I responded with my brand of advice on the "Lord" thread.

SS

Larrydee,

Thank you. All veterans should stick together. I really hope our veterans serving overseas coming home soon. I spent 10 1/2 years in the Air Force, then I was put out on a medical discharge. I was an Avionics Technican, and one day I was coming down the ladder from the cockpit of an airplane, when I was hit across the back of the head with a metal grate. It was a serious whiplash injury, I now have limited use of my left arm and debilitating migraines (from the blow to the head) that last for 3-4 days. It took almost 3 years (you know how the VA is - slow)  but I finally got my 100%. I'm very proud to have been able to serve our country for 10 1/2 years, I wish it could have been longer.

Katjo74,

There are 2 kinds of red mange localized and generalized. Generalized usually spreads across the whole body and is a immune problem and the dog should be spayed or neutered. Localized is usually a small spot or two and it clears up on its own and the dog can still be used for breeding, I was told this by a dermatologist for animals. Lord had a small spot on his face and it cleared up and never came back, so potentially I could use him for breeding, if I was to ever get his papers that is. 

I've thought about the small claims court but I live all the way in Minnesota and I would have to file in North Carolina. The thing that is really interesting is Beth's husband is the county attorney there in McDowell county NC. He has to know what she's doing is illegal. 

I know there are good breeders out there, I've found a couple, but this kind of experience can make you kind of cynical. I know to be more careful now when buying a puppy, but I thought I was being careful then and buying from a reputable kennel, I did research her on this board and the internet but didn't find anything bad.   Katjo74 that is one gorgeous girl you got there!

I hope everyone has a happy holiday this year!

Robin

If her husband is the County Attorney that may work in your favor.   The Internet and Google are wonderful for gathering information.  A few minutes of searching and this is what I have come up with. First it also appears that Beth Coats is a maltese breeder as well so you might check out some of their boards and see if there have been any similiar problems. She is also an horse breeder and apparently is registered with the state see http://www.agr.state.nc.us/markets/livestock/horse/directory/view.asp?Action=Specific&SpecificID=312  You May want to contact this department and see if it's possible to register a complaint against her with them since  they are the Dept of Ag AND Consumer Services.

I did find a D. Fred Coats as County Attorney for McDowell county where Beth Coats lives. This is an appointed position subject to the whim of the commissioners ( more on that later). See http://www.mcdowellgov.com/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC=%7B5FB301C7-7CCE-4485-A661-990B83911159%7D Please note that the County Attorney handles CIVIL matters not criminal ones. I would start by logging a complaint with the Sheriff's department see  http://www.mcdowellgov.com/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC={A6644AD9-A56D-4815-84F4-100A4879C94C}  AND I would do this in conjunction and cooperation with Lord's breeder since you have similiar and somewhat overlapping complaints of possible criminal action.  NOTE the Sheriff is an ELECTED position. (More on this later also). Once again a Google search would bring you to several sources of the NC laws.Here is one http://www.ncleg.net/gascripts/Statutes/StatutesTOC.pl?Chapter=0014  . Just browsing here are some possible statutes that may apply ( and note the events may involve more than one. It would be up to the prosecuting atty to decide what charges would be leveled) False Pretense and Cheats http://www.ncleg.net/enactedlegislation/statutes/html/bysection/chapter_14/gs_14-100.html  Vatrious receiving/possessing stolen goods  http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-71.html , http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-71.1.html,  http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-72.html , Larceny of a chose in action http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-75.html Larceny of horses,swine...dogs http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-81.html, Fraudulent and deceptive advertising http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Stat

Now  I would be polite and nice with the Sheriff's department but I woud also express a desire to be kept up to date and say up front you are concerned about possible conflict of interest because of Fred's positiion with the county. Now personally I think an elected sheriff is going to be more interested in his own a** so you don't have to worry. However if after giving them some time to pursue matters you felt things were being swept under the rug Fred's position actually works in your favor. Why? because now you can go to the state  and claim that there is a conflict of interest and they need to step in and handle the investigation.  I would check here if that becomes necessary http://www.ncsbi.gov/ and also ask the State Attorney General's office to take over the case http://www.ncdoj.com/.

Once the state takes over THEN the fun can begin perhaps with a few well place phone calls/emails/letters to local and statewide newspapers, radio and tv stations alerting them to events unfolding.  I can see the headlines-  Something along the lines of - State takes over case looking into the possiblity of criminal charges against County Attorney's wife. Local Sheriff's office loses control of case because of possible conflicts of interest."  At this point those local county commissioners who appoint the County Attorney are going to want to CTA  as well as the sheriff who has to worry about winning the next election. If the prosecutor is also elected all the more power to you - I can see him rubbing his hands together in glee. They LOVE press that makes them look good.

So that would be my suggestion presuming that you have exhausted the normal notice and demand processes without any response.  Please note that in this country we have a bifurcated legal system and while the county/state is pursing the criminal side you also have a right to pursue the civil side. Be careful on the civil side and learn what the Statutue of limitations is - some are fairly short ( a year) because if it runs your action will be barred.  Many states now have great court sites loaded with info esp for small claims and pro per representation. You may be able to file initially by mail or affadavit or electronically so check it out. I wish you luck in getting this resolved.

Kitkat,

Lord was bred in Serbia at Topolovnicka Kennels, Moma sold Lord and 3 other pups to Amel Sefer of Sefer Haus Kennels who was supposed to pay Moma $4000 for the puppies but he stiffed Moma and so Moma never got a cent for the 4 pups. I bought Lord from Beth Coats of  Eichen Hugel Kennels in North Carolina. How Beth got Lord I'm not sure, all I know is I paid her $2000 not including shipping and crate, for as she advertised a show/breeding prospect. How can a dog be a show/breeding prospect when she can't provide papers for him? I even had her xray his hips to make sure his hips were ok before buying him, I don't know if she actually did it or not (since I'm a little too trusting) but she said his hips looked good enough to pass OFA at 2. Of course, after all this stuff happened I had my own vet check his hips and he said they looked good.

Tig,

Thanks for the information, D. Fred Coats is Beth Coats husband. I'm going to look thru those links you posted to see what they say. I didn't know the county attorney handled civil matters. I'm going to call the Sheriff's department and talk to them about this and see what they say, it can't hurt. Maybe, if I got my money back, I could then pay Moma to get my boys papers, then I would be very happy and Moma would at least have the money for one of the pups he sold.

Robin

Today's your lucky day then.  If the husband of this fraud is in a public position - beautiful!!  Organize all your information concisely and factually and simply - then simply contact any and all local newspapers and television (include radio, too, if you feel like it) stations in her home town.  I'm sure at least one of them will pick it up.  For instance, look at the local area newspaper or tv station and find out who their investigative reporter is.  Bet they'll jump on the fact that a public employee is making money by a selling-dogs-and-cheating-buyers racket.  You can also address a letter to the city or town council, with a copy to the press - that'll get their attention.