If SchH titles are so important.... - Page 1

If Schutzhund titles are so important for this breed why isn't it mandatory for show dogs to participate in national level Schutzhund before being able to be qualified for VA status or top 10 V?

If you truly want to improve the quality of the showlines I say make it so that it's required for these dogs to participate with the big boys at national level before being qualified to obtain VA or top V ratings.

Showdogs should have no special treatment when performing at national level.

In my opinion this is the quickest way to improve the protection performance at sieger shows and to get rid of all of the flaws in the showline blood.

 Don't they need a schutzhund title before getting a VA or a V..I tought they had to. As soon as they get 24 months of age.

july9000, Yes its required for the working class males/females to optain a SchH title to recieve either a  V  or VA.

 So you can be more than 24 months and not be in the working class?? I thought to get a VA or V you absolutly had to have at least a schutzhund 1.  Sorry if I look dumb but that was my impression. I've looked at sieger and participate two times with puppies buti'm not aware on how all the different class works..

To ask a dog qualify for the nationals or the bundesseiger in order to be allowed a VA would never happen.  Even if it did, how could you possibly hold a schutzhund event that could accomodate the 300+ working dogs in the Sieger show each year? The bottom line is, if temperment is important to a breeder/buyer, it is that person's INDIVIDUAL responsibility to reasearch what they are buying and pay attention to what they are breeding to.  Putting harder requirements on Seiger show perfomance work is a step in the right direction, lets see where it takes us this year. Rather than waste time complaining about a problem controlled by money and politics, I think one's time is better spent researching, training, titling and learning to actually contribute to a declining quality gene pool.

july, I hate to sound catty, but for someone who has a lot of negative things to say about the german breeding/showing/sport system, you sure don't know much about it. Brittany is referring to schutzhund competetion on a national level, essentially making it so that every VA dog would have to be the equivalent of a Universal Seiger candidate.

I've got a much easier idea to implement- can VAs stop being awarded to dogs with noch zuglassen hips/elbows?

IMO

I would like to see a system where the V and VA titles are difficult to acheive and are reserved for only the Very Best which I think should include the TOTAL GSD from their mental aspects, drives, confirmation, health(including hips).

Since I do not compete I am not saying any current ones are not worthy of their titles but based this only things I have read and heard about.  This to me was disappointing because as a lover of GSD's I hate to see anything degrade the breed.

I know this sounds simple but it appears for various reasons some inferior dogs are getting higher ratings than they deserve and once they have a title people want to breed them and consequently produce lower quality dogs based on wanting them to meet all of the breed standards.  Same for working dogs as breeding for certain traits and ignoring others is not the best thing for the breed.

A dog must have a SchH 2 to go VA

Whoops, A dog must have a minimum of SchH 2 in order to go VA

 KCaja,

I'm SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO not negative on schutzhund and the german lines ( altough I do hate those roach back).  I'm not negative about the dogs..I'm negative about narrow minded people who think they know it all. I'm just asking questions and yes I don't know much about german style show judging.  But YOU seems to know a lot so that is good for me!

I've been to 1 sieger ( it's was so small that it looked like a pic-nic on a sunday afternoon!) people entered their dogs (working guys) and we're laughning presenting them as it was like a joke. I've shown 2 puppies with one of them with rating of very promising and the other one promising. but it wasn't enough to learn really about it.  When you want to learn you go with peoples who are passionate about it.  They're is 1 guy I know aroud here importing show lines (that was in fact the most beautiful german dog i've seen with my eyes!). But He had trouble with the papers so..everybody who did breed him never received the papers!

When people talk schutzhund around here..they talk working not showing (in fact..talking to you guys make me feel like i'm going back in time!!). I was in Boston cheering up the canadian team when the world Championship was there. I was really impress about the quality of the working dogs been shown. But my Goodness..Some dogs don't even look like GSD and because they are so good at working they breed them. I can"t believe those dogs could have had any kind of conformation rating as good for breeding..

Yes i would like to see more dogs having working titles..but I want them looking like GSD..

+Showdogs should have no special treatment when performing at national level.+

NO dog should have special treatment when performing at ANY level IMO.

Regarding your opinions, you are entitled. You will not attaine getting rid of working dogs, show dog, work/show dogs faults by only allowing those dogs that perform at national levels to breed. First of all  not all owners have the ego desire to do that type of competition. The dogs dont know any better and they are not better or worse for doing it.

HOW or why you feel it would clean up genetics and selection is a mystery to me. IF it , breeding and producing good dogs over the test of time would never be achieved. It is achieved all the time, there are many very good dogs of different family lines in the breed to day..the breed is not in ruines, the world can be a happy place..no chicken little the sky is not falling take a breath. (G)

Yes, I am being a little sarcastic. I have a wry sense of humor and needed to make myself laugh. ;)

Debi