Benefits of getting a trainer? - Page 1

Sorry for the newbie question, please bear with me! :-)

My husband and I are currently looking for a German Shepherd.  From reading the message boards here I noticed that some of you send your dogs away for training.  What is the reason for this?  We do not want to purchase a puppy but we are considering a younger dog but with three young children in our house it is vital that any dog we get is very well trained.  Would we benefit from sending our new dog away to a trainer?  How long does the training last for; days, weeks, months?  Sorry if this is a stupid question, I was just curious.

Louise

 Louise,

I train dogs and mostly, I train people to train their own dog. I have many people who want me to simply train their dog for them. I do EVERYTHING possible to convince them that they should find a trainer who will train THE PEOPLE to train the dog. It takes time, and patience, and most of all, commitment. When people here talk about sending a dog off, most of the time they are talking about sending the dog for specialized training for Schutzhund or show. One cannot do these kinds of training without a lot of help and experience. But for a pet, YOU should train your dog. NOT the KIDS, you. So find a competent trainer and get involved learning how to train your dog. Like with children, it is many years of effort.

Good luck.

Hi Louise, there are many benefits to using a trainer and I'm certain more experienced people will give you better responses to your questions as I have never sent a dog away to be trained, but here's my take. First is your dog only going to be a pet? That might make a big difference in what you chose to do.

My dogs have only ever been pets, but I always work WITH a trainer (privately). The trainer works with me to get the most out of the dog and helps me to become a better handler. I'm sure you've heard that it's not the dog that's being trained, it's the owner. I feel this is very true. When you work with a trainer you are being trained along side your dog. I have owned many GSDs and every one has had a very different personality and they didn't all repsond the same to the same training techniques. My trainer helps me tweak the way I handle the dog to get the best out of him. I work with my trainer weekly and practice what we've been working on in between our weekly sessions. An added benefit is that I can discuss individual issues I may be having with the dog as they come up.

You mentioned that you have children. When my daughter was younger and still lived with me, she frequently participated in training sessions so she could learn how to properly handle the dog(s). Doing that enabled us to have consitency in handling and made training a family experience.

Good luck with your pup!! I'm sure (s)he will make a wonderful addition to your family.

Karen

Britmum,

I agree with hodie here on finding a trainer who trains you to train your dog. If cost is a factor in getting a private trainer, depending were you live there might be a local dog training club in your area who usual offers puppy classes and beginners classes, as well as more advanced classes in obedience, rally, agility and so on for a very reasonable price. If you live in the US stay away from Petsmart/Petco "training", its a waste of money.

What age are your kids? Even tho a puppy is more work to begin with, but when growing up with your kids the puppy does not know any different as that there are kids. You need to ask yourself the question can an "older" dog be fully trusted regarding your kids, even when the dog would come fully trained to your house?

I have sent the dogs out, have done it myself and I have had private lessons. It all depends on the amount of time you have and what type of training your looking for. If you purchsed a dog, I am hoping you have time for it. I am self employed and at times I have been in need of some "specialized training" and sent the dog out. However, in doing it this way if you think you can just get a dog home that now has perfect manners or gives you his capabilities, without YOU "learning" how to work the dog, not going to happen. They all come home with selective hearing  and thinking maybe you do not know the rules. You have to rebond with the dog and go thru the paces with the dog. The selective hearing stage is actually quite funny.

As a dog trainer who trains people and dogs for living.....here is my opinion....

And, yes, I have many of them;

I like Board/Trains IF the owner does not have time and CONSISTANCY to follow through with training.

---In my training contracts(I only do privates and b/t's, no group classes at the moment), I require people to commit to at least an hour of day of CONCERTED Training.  I require them to keep a log---it keeps them honest---and to do at least 45 repittions of each command each day.  If they cannot/will not commit to this, I recommend board/trains.

---If I see a wishy-washy client, one who doesn't like to set boundries and disipline their dogs, I will recommend a board/train

---If I see a client who one second is telling the dog "DOWN" for jumping on them(wrong command, should be off) and then petting the dog a few minutes later, I will recommend board/trains---this is, btw, after a session or two, and the clients are just not getting it.

---I will recommend a b/t if I see that the owner is very, very frustrated with the dog, and ready to rehome the dog.  Often times, getting the dog out of the house for a period of time helps.

With any type of dog trainer, you will learn that sometimes there are some people who are very excellent dog trainers, but horrid instructors, in that they are incapable of communicating to you what needs to be done.

Beware of any trainer who offers a "lifetime" guarantee.  While it is possible for me to guarantee that when the dog leaves my home it will be doing the following commands:(Insert commands taught), there is absolutely no guarantee that you(any owner) will do what I tell you to do, and follow through with training.

Make sure that you ask for references, ask to see facility, or talk to people who have hired trainer.  If you don't like what you see/hear, walk away.  Simple as that.  There are also some "certifying" agencies out there:  IACP(International Association of Canine Professionals).  I was a co-founder of this organization.  It is a good organization, that requires more of it's professional members than simply $50.00 and a piece of paper---you have to prove that you have been training.   NADOI is another good organizaton.  Lesser known, but anyone who is a member, has put out some effort to become one. 

I have absolutely no use for APDT or their certification process---anyone can take and pass a multiple choice question test.  Other organizations require videos of training processes, essay questions, etc.....

I have no use for trainers who only train one way.  There should be a mirade of training tools in ones toolbox....everything from clickers to e-collars.  If a trainer does only train one way, then they should be honest, and let people know that up front.

Some trainers will have no experience with certain issues, and that is fine, as long as they are honest about it, and refer you to someone who does and can help you.

Dog training is a never ending process, in my opinoin.  You have to "keep working the program" as it were.  Even after you have a dog to be proud of, you have to maintain that dog in the future---which means training.

I alway recommend that people invest in a yearly group class(great distractions, structured learning place, etc) to keep up on obedience.

While, I agree, that some people can manage to train their dogs without professional help, or going to a group class, I find that most won't do it.  Or they will "half ass" it.  Classes or private instructors make you "own up" to your work.  It forces you to actually work and practice....

Again, only some opinions....

&

I agree with TheDogTrainer about 95%. Spot on with the boarding and training comments. I am another all breed trainer that does a combo of in kennel training, private lessons and classes.  I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks APDT is crap.

Now, there are lots of good trainers out there with no certs of any kind, just years of experience. As far as method goes, in my opinion a trainer should not bounce around too widely from method to method, it becomes confusing for the dog. A good trainer knows how to tailor their method of choice to suit any dog.  (You'll never catch me dead with a clicker )

If you have 3 small children, it may be worth your while to send you dog away for a strong foundation in basics, simply because of the time constraints in your life. I'm a parent, too, I understand. At the kennel I work for this takes about 3 weeks to teach heel, sit, down, stay, come, variations on all those commands and basic manners, at a rate of around $400 per week.

That said, a lot of boarding training programs out there just plain suck. It's a rather expensive type of training as well. Please, please, do your homework before sending your baby away. Ask to see dogs work that are nearing the end of their stay, so you can get an idea of what you are paying for. A trainer should ALWAYS allow you to see them at work before you commit to sending your dog there! If you see a well trained dog, don't be a afraid to ask the owner where they train, it's a great way to get referrals.

 KCzaja,

Agree that APDT is bogus, at best. Also agree that experience and not some bogus certification is worth more. Most "certifying" agencies are in it to do one thing, and that is make money.

Clicker training is an unnecessary gimick. 

And disagree 100% about the length of time a client should spend training a dog per day. I would NEVER spend that kind of time with a single dog daily. I subscribe to intensity and drive and attentiveness in training and dogs cannot give that for more than a few minutes, especially initially, unless they are a serious exception to the rule. I have such a dog, but I would also never do this with her. Otherwise, I agree with the post of DogTrainer in general.

Again, sure, I can make money training your dog....but I prefer to train YOU to train your dog. That gives the owner of the dog a much better chance at success because training is a lifetime commitment. If someone really does not have the time to train their own dog, and understand how to work with the dog, it may be that they should own a fish or a cat or a gerbil.

As for wishy-washy clients, I found that by requiring payment up front for 10 lessons minimally, I was able to weed out people who were not serious. Personally, even though I could always take someone's money and use it, I don't want to waste my valuable time training someone who is not serious. So I am lucky so far in the excellent clients and students I have had, be they in-house staying here with me for some time, or just coming from the local area once or twice a week.

I think even if someone buys an already trained dog you as the owner/handler will still need taught how to handle your dog properly.  With that being said here's basically how I tell people to decide what is best for you; if you're limited with experience and time to committ then getting a trained dog is the way to go IF you research what you are buying and whom you are buying it from.  A lot of people don't have the patience to go through the puppy stages, crate training, housebreaking, chewing ect....so they lean towards an already trained dog HENCE will cost you much more than if you purchase a nice pup and do the work yourself.  BUT if you are planning to hire a trainer and work with the pup from ground up yourself by the time you get the dog to the point you're satisfied you probably could have spent the same or even less amount of money getting one already trained without having to go through the puppy pains.

Just from the brief description of your situation I'd probably buy an already trained dog and find myself a good trainer to follow up with and learn how to manage the dog.