Which would you believe more? - Page 1

After reading thread on standard and "kennel blindness" (here) I had two questions relating to websites/advertisements:

• Who would you believe more for a dog's titles and ratings? The owner/breeder's website or the information on the database?

• Would it make a difference if the breeding in question was a breeder who didn't show but had several litters a year, or a competitive kennel with a known reputation and show presence?

(Not looking to start a fight, just wanted to see what other people's thoughts were)

~J.C.

I would NOT believe the database.  Anyone can enter info into the database wether it is CORRET info or not.  As far as believing a breeders website, you can always ask the breeder for PROOF of titles and ratings.

I like your questions. They speak to the buyer of a companion dog. Buyers of competition dogs are, for the most part, in the loop already and need neither an Internet database nor a breeder's Website on which to base their decisions. Buyers of companion dogs, those refered to as "just pets", do rely on the sources you mention.

When we researched breeders for our new puppy we knew two things: the lines we didn't want and the lines we did want. We checked the database for our desired lines and then meandered through the Internet looking at their progeny. We eventually found a breeder who concentrated on our preferred lines. We checked the claims on her Website against information available on the Internet. For instance, if it says XYZ went VA at such-and-such a show, that's pretty easy to verify.

All breeders'  Websites say pretty much the same, had you noticed? We belong to USCA, GSDCA, SV. We breed to the standard (which standard??). We OFA. We CERF. All our dogs are raised in the house. Yadda yadda yadda. We weren't necessarily looking for a name brand kennel but on the other hand, we weren't looking for a one-litter-every-three-years breeder, either.

We searched the USCA site on breeder's last name to see how much/often/why he/she showed the dogs. Trained enough to meet the minumum requirements for a breed survey was a plus, more so, in fact, than a breeder who cranks out Vs each year (but not many SchH3s or FH3s) - because we weren't looking for a working (or competition) dog.

Communications with the breeder were critical. Could they give us names of past buyers? Did they know whether their 7 or 8 year old progeny had ever suffered bloat? Allergies? EPI? Are they still in touch with their old puppy buyers?

A known reputation is a good thing if it's a good reputation but the only way you know that is by reading a variety of forums and talking to people. And going to shows and trials.

As it turned out our research using PDB and the Internet in general led us to an excellent breeder. How did people find their new puppies in the olden days, before this resource was available?????

I don't believe anything I can't see with my own 2 eyes.

1-owner breeder,,, if all else fails ask to see the scorebook,, if they are unwilling to share that info, thats another story

2- at first i would have to say competition kennel.  i would consider a breeding kennel, but only if i was able to actually see the dogs work in person, or had see prodgeny out of the parents.

john

The first thing I would do is cross-reference the database and the breeder's website.  If there's stuff that doesn't match I'd find out why. 

But anyone can put whatever they want on their own website... they can also post misinformation on the database.

I was going to reply to this topic when it initially appeared but just couldn't put my thoughts down into any clear & concise sentences... so thank you Aqua for doing it for me!

Couldn't agree more with your sentiments and the catch words must be research, research & more research. And isn't that what is always advised on this board to new prospective GSD buyers?

As you & I mentioned (in a different thread) this is relatively easy when you are already 'in' the dog world, whether it be show or competition, but for a person looking for a companion dog that is a balanced example of the breed in both conformation & temperament  this is not always understood or even desirable.

The same holds true when buying anything, some people blunder in and buy the first thing they see or are sold on & others will do research & give thought to the pros & cons of a different purchases. The latter does make for a dry, excitement free event perhaps but the rewards will be tenfold for many years to come.

And as for answering the topic question I think KCzaja hit the nail on the head!

AandA.

A good reputable breeder should be pleased to show official documentation for everything claimed concerning parents of a litter (hip certification, titling, proper vaccinating, etc). Actually, I provide a copy of all documentation on both parents inserted in the puppy packet of my litters for new owners as a standard. OFA hip certification, copy of title/certification certificate, pedigree, AKC papers on both parents, etc. I stamp them all with 'COPY' in places so its known its not an original, but they get to SEE the originals on my walls and in neat notebooks when they come and pick out a pup. Even if the clients don't ask to see the paperwork on parents, I gladly get my stuff out and show them voluntarily.
If a breeder acts offended that you wanna see proof of hip/titlement claims like you don't believe their word alone, then steer clear.
If a breeder offers nothing more to validate a claim than a public database, again, well, consider. A client asking questions should NOT be a problem to a good breeder-the only dumb question is an unasked one, IMO.
NEVER accept a public source like a pedigree database where it can be changed at any time by anyone as GOSPEL. Generally things are decently accurate, but people falsify things all the time, too.