Breeding Longevity - Page 1

What is the typical age that a male GSD usually starts having problems breeding females? I know that there are many exceptions, but what would you say is a typical age? And do many males start producing smaller litters, before going totally sterile? Is there increased chance of puppy health problems when using aged males? I am considering using an aged male and would like some information from those of you with knowlege of this....

At a minimum have a vet do a semen analysis before you decide. Should give you a clear idea of count, motility and % of defective sperm. If he has never been used before or it's been a long time you might have to collect him - more than once to get an accurate picture.

Years ago I bred to an 11 year old male - his first time. 9 healthy pups who all lived to ripe old ages . Also no stillborns.

I've seen dogs go sterile as young as 5 and others still breeding at 12+ ( AKC I believe requires such a breeding to be attested by a vet). Many dogs go sterile for no apparent reason tho my personal suspicion is it might have something to do with the amount of crate time some dogs get these days - not optimal conditions for sperm production, keeps the heat too high.

In horses researchers have found fertility and fecundity to be directly related to testicle size which in turn is related to the males exposure to breeding, cycling males - i.e. the harem effect. In dogs breeding vigor which includes the above but also the ability and desire to breed definitely seems to have a genetic component. So I would question re his relatives and their breeding histories.

Finally in humans, researchers using old sweaty T shirts have found that partner selection is influenced by smell with the most desirable mate being one that has a complementary immune system thus creating the possiblity of a stronger immune system in the next generation.  I've seen  a similar phenomena in dogs where very highly linebred dogs appeared to have little or no breeding vigor but were being bred to bitches w/ nearly identical pedigrees - certainly not the complementary or hybrid vigor situation of the T shirt test .

A related question to board members if I may.  I have been noticing on German/European lines for a number of years a trend to consistently small litters(2-4 pups).   Historically GSDs averaged about 6 pups in a litter and large litters of 9 -13 where not at all unusual. So what's going on? Genetics? Lousy timing? the Herpes or related genital viruses? Stress? Increasing use of AI? (does SV allow? They don't allow frozen do they?), Overused or underused stud dogs?  Any thoughts on the cause...

Although the male has to have enough sperm (the ratio of sperm to eggs is considerable or should be) to fertilize the eggs.. it is the female who determines  how many pups, she has to have enough eggs for the sperm to fertilize..

Males determine the sex and then it takes 2 to tango for just about everything else!!

Some believe the number of pups has something to do with the number of times the bitch was covered, so they only allow one or two matings if they want a smaller litter. I don't know if there is any truth to this, but I DO know female cats often don't ovulate until they are covered, thus they will stay in heat unless allowed access to a male. (This can be quite hard on the owner's nerves, needless to say!)

My puppy came from an 'oops' litter, and since the breeder was hoping the bitch wouldn't take, she was only covered once, (they think) and produced only two pups. Proof for the above? I really don't know!  I DO know the SV requires pups to be fostered to other bitches if there are more than six in the litter.

Dk  I know we have been taught for eons that the male determines the sex- because after all they carry the y chromosome BUT recent research suggests it is actually the female of the species which determines the sex. It is much  more complicated than this but the apparantly the females body can be receptive or hostile to the y carrying sperm through such things as ph level etc.

Sunsilver. Cat and dog reproductive systems are very very different.  Queens ovulate on demand - i.e. they must be bred to ovulate. This is the reason they keep cycling back and it is also the reason for the very high fertility rate. The act of breeding flushes the egg which then gets fetilized.

Bitches however ovulate whether or not they get bred. They ovulate at their progesterone peak which may or may not be standing heat  when they flag. ( usually there is a relationship but not always). Furthermore the egg must mature for an additional two days before it can be fertilized. One cover could produce a small litter if it was at the wrong time or a large litter if timed right.  Other factors in litter size were listed above in TIG's post but actually one of the very strong inheritable traits is reproductive health in bitches - timing and frequency of cycle and number of pups produced. So I think TIGs question is a good one. Are we looking at a change in the genetic reproductive state of these bitches or is there something else going on.

Great question and info from TIG!

Smaller litters provide a breeder to test the combination. to hold back a pup so I have time to evaluate. 

VKF, I suspected the idea of litter size being related to the number of breedings was an old wive's tale. Thanks for confirming that! 

Sunsilver, I don't know that I would go quite so far as saying litter size was NOT related to the number of breedings. What I have not seen is a discussion of how and when a bitch sheds her eggs once the proper progesterone level is reached. Practically speaking I can see where there might be differences in time between eggs and also possible differences in the maturation time.  In implanting frozen semen they go late not early and I suspect it's to cover this type of occurence. Also ancedotal but you will sometimes hear breeders talk about radical differences in puppy sizes and devlopment in a litter where the dam had beed bred multiple times or two times widely apart because she maintained a standing heat. The suspicion always is that one puppy was conceived a day or two later(which is huge in a newborn). I think we simply do not know enough about the some of these issues to really know.

That being said here is a really informative article by a reproductive vet . Note it has information on stud dog issues as well which RR you might find useful.    http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=1224&EVetID=242359 

Awesome link.. I just bought Dr Hutch's DVD's.. I've been told that if you can find a seminar where he is speaking, you should get there!!

Haven't had a chance to watch the dvd's yet.. they can be ordered directly from his office.....  Northview in Ohio I believe.. a search will bring it up

Ok I have never heard of th SV requiring a foster mother with a litter over six.  How would they even know you did or did not foster them to another bitch.  Can someone explain the SV's procedure on this or direct me to a link.  Thanks

Karmen