hip x-rays, straight positioning? - Page 1

I'm going to use a different vet for my dogs' OFA x-rays in the future, because my current vet simply can't seem to get the positioning straight enough.  I'm giving up on using him for x-rays, hurts to pay for crooked x-rays that shouldn't be sent in and should be re-done for free (but no vet would do that).

I had an older dog x-rayed at a different vet, just to check the hips as a part of an all-over health exam.  These are the x-rays - I would like opinions mainly on if these x-rays are positioned correctly or not - if not, why not - (I'm looking at the kneecaps and thinking they should be centered better, but might be wrong there) - and if anyone wants to critique the hips that's fine too (9 year old dog, x-rays taken a few years ago)

thanks, molly

I'd prefer the patellae to be positioned more as in these (both with Acepromazine sedation--no general anesthesia):

Molly, I think the knees should be rotated inwardly. They are not. Very nice hips for a 9 year old GSD. I think they would look even deeper if the knees were right.

When I was taught to do hip xrays (by 2 Penn grads),  they stressed the importance of always grasping the dog below the knees and rotating the knees inwardly as that sets the balls as deeply as possible.  The xraying tech on the rear end of the dog needs to exert a fair amount of pressure when "twisting" those knees inwardly, another reason that most dogs should be at least tranqed for a hip xray; most will fight that manipulation.

Rotating the knees may not make a huge difference for a dog like this one as he clearly has very good  hip conformation for his breed and age. However, on the closer ones, it could mean the difference between a pass or fail or even a better rating assuming the depth of the socket and the fit of the head were called into question. The legs could be a tad bit straighter, but it's still a good x-ray IMO and of diagnostic quality and one I'd submit to OFA. 

OFA does say that the knees need to be rotated inwardly, but I don't believe they would reject this xray due to the positioning since they can  see there is no question about this dog's hips.

Louise's xrays clearly show how the knees should be rotated inwardly.

I agree the first set of xrays needs better position. The knees are not at 90 degree angles and neither is the pelvis. My vet also rotates the knees inward.

In the first two of the three xrays the hip on the right side of the image is closer to the xray film and thus larger than the remaining hip on the left side of the image (due to the pelvis being slightly rotated along the axis of the spine). 

Both hips should be the same size and the legs should be straight (the knees are rotated outward from the spinal axis in the first xray, which makes the balls appear shallower inset into the sockets than they really are). 

If one hip is larger on the image, then that ball will appear to be deeper set into the socket than it actually is.  Actually neither of the three xrays is positioned properly with the legs straight and exactly parallel.  The third xray has the best positioning, the first the worst.  On the third xray the leg on the left side of the image is not straight (it is pushed in slightly toward the spinal axis).

My interpretation of each set of hips is that they are all good, with the third and final set superb or superior (take your choice).

any recommendations for a vet who takes VERY good x-rays (positioned correctly) in central PA, or within a couple hours of here (Philadelphia, Baltimore, DC, northern VA, MD) - thanks.  I can see that in my x-ray, if the knees had been rotated correctly the hips would have looked "tighter" and therefore "better".  I wasn't planning on sending those in anyway - the dog was already OFA Good - the x-rays were just taken as a part of a senior whole-body health check/exam.  But it was nice to see the hips looked good for the age/breed :) - still I wanted to check these x-rays as the vet that took them was on my list as a possibility to take my dogs to for OFAs in the future.  I'll keep looking, recommendations are appreciated.

Thanks very much for your advice!

molly

I agree entirely with what Preston has written. We do the best positioning that we can get without subjecting the dogs to the risks inherent in general anesthesia. BTW, the third xray was not submitted to the OFA--a better one was sent in.

Louise, I agree about xraying without anesthesia.  That is what I have always done.  But it takes a vet or tech that is very calm and relaxed and takes extra time to get accquaited with the dog first. The vet I have used for years who just etired had a special gift.  I really didn't think he could do my Sch2 male without a muzzle.  He said it would be no problem.  He always would have me in the xray room helping with 2 assistants and would use a foot pedal to take the xrays.  He took some time and got to know my dog first and then was easily able to do what I couldn't have done by myself.  Funny thing was my dog really enjoyed the whole experience.  But this vet had a special gift.  He had a library of good and bad import Xrays with all ranges of SV ratings.  He would pull them out and show me good and bad at two years old with one year SV ratings. I saw a lot of marginal hips rated "A normal" by the SV,  which surprised me.  He was also seeeing about 20-25% elbow problems in import GSDs. The best hips he ever showed me were from a black lab that were so deep with such a perfect fit that it was astounding.  I told him I would expect that dog to have a limited rang of motion in the rear due to the very deep fit, since a super deep fit can be linked to less looseness in the rear, less freely moving rear and less range of motion (wehich would be fine with me since I always like to see Ofa excellent hips with super deep sockets.

In my experiencve the only time positioning is a big deal and requires near perfection is with shallower clean hips suchs as which typically get an Ofa fair rating.  These are very sensitive to rotation of the pelvis at the spine and non parallel legs without straight knee alignment. In these cases a GSD can easily get an unacceptable rating when it deserves a fair rating.

By the way I would have expected the third xray to have been rated Ofa excellent and I am surprised that they were not. I would probably have resubmitted them since they are so excellent.

No, but grandpa was OFA "excellent":

Again, I did not send these to the OFA--opted for slightly straighter positioning--also, taken with Acepromazine sedation.