Over-Socialization? - Page 1

I have noticed in abundance that many people (including breeders) say that you must socialize your GSD a lot so he/she doesn't become fearful, nervebag, etc.  You have people being told to take their dogs everywhere from your kids recitial to a ride along with a police department so they can develop strong nerves.

Have we gotten to the point of too much socializaition?  People getting new dogs are told, "SOCALIZE YOUR DOG!!!  SOCIALIZE THEM!!"Now with some lines of GSD's you do need to make sure they are well socialized b/c there could be a higher chance in the dogs genes for social aggression or a higher rate of suspicion.  But in general terms why all of this over the top socialization? 

It has started to make me wonder what is being bred if you have to socialize the dog so much?  What happened to just normal activites that you do daily that help your dog?  Why is it now you have to take 6 hours a week to go out of your way to socialize?  Are the GSD being bred now more fragile and need this special attention?

Ace,
Don't confuse 'socializing' a puppy with
having it 'mauled' by strangers
Most workingline people will suggest
you get that puppy out to 'see the world',
nothing more. Let the puppy see different
sights & sounds, crowds etc. If you **have**
to do this with a puppy, well, then you are in
some serious trouble.

When we get a new pup, we take him along
to various places, get him out by the market
to walk around, see people, grocery carts, kids
etc. Once in awhile we may make a trip to an
airport to do the same, just expose to sights
and sounds. But if we don't get him out
'every' day, we certainly don't freak out and
think he'll turn into a spook!

It's all about just letting the puppy be a dog.
Nothing special really.

My lad was never socialised with people or other dogs outside his family and pack, not for lack of trying I may add.  He met people, he met other dogs, he just didn't give a hoot, he's only ever been interested in me.  For a dog that refused to socialise, He's 110% solid with strangers and strange dogs.

I never thought about it all the years I have owned dogs.  I just take my dog with me where ever I go (that is appropriate to do so.. and most places I go are dog appropriate). 

No point in having dogs if you are just going to leave them home. 

Never had a problem. 

I don't go out of my way to socialize either. I don't see the point in it, because every single time I go out somewhere, there's going to be someone, as workingdogz said, who will 'maul' my dog. I don't mind if people LOOK, or talk to them, or ask me questions about them, I'm all for my kids being breed ambasadors, but even the most docile dog might be taken aback for a minute having a rowdy little kid they don't know run up and fling their arms around them. Happend to my Pitbull once. She just gave me the "what the hell is this all about, mom?" look, and when I told her it was okay she gave the little girl a kiss, but the little girl just ran up from behind and tackled her. She didn't like it, she wasn't expecting it and frankly, I'm amazed she didn't so much as utter a growl from being attacked from behind.

I've had other dogs who would go out of their way to greet people, and just loved people in general. Great for entertaining but I usually like my dogs to at least try to maintain composure because not every person they meet should be greeted with such enthusiasm.

I had a Czech bitch once that wasn't fearful but man was she aloof. Didn't like anyone she didn't know, and she had no problem making sure that there was a gap between mommy and the stranger. She was pretty no-nonsense but had such a hard time really allowing anyone into my life, it was hard to take her places.

I think the key is yes, socializing but don't force your dog/puppy upon anyone who happens to be standing withing a 500ft. radius because you want to socialize them. Ace hit it right on the head, if you really must do that so your dog will accept people, it makes me wonder if we are breeding dogs that require an absurd amount of socializing to make them 'safe'.

How you all see it has been my take on it.  When I go out I let them ride along in the back when I have short errands and I know I wont be in a store long or something.  I don't go out of my way so to speak but if there is an chance for them to come along then I do it.  I just incorporate into my daily life.

I do see now thought that people really push socialization more than what I think is necessary.  People going out of their way and tryign to find new things and it's like "wow".  If the dog is from a good stable breeding you shouldn't have to go through all that.

If the dog is fearful or weak nerved, no amount of socialization will totally fix the problem.

Ace, you are spot on. If a puppy has to to be " socialized " or exposed to everything imaginable to grow up to be a functional dog in society, then something drastic is lacking in the breeding program!! I have young dogs here that I've raised that can be as old as six or eight months the first time they go to town. They take everything in stride as a matter of normalcy, never hesitating ro investigate, and strut their stuff. Walking in amongst groups of shoppers is no big deal to them; they're just people and nothing unusual about it. These dogs have been raised by humans and none of them act as though strangers are from another planet. However , I will say that my dogs don't greet any stranger like they're a long lost friend. Strangers are not a big deal to them, they just treat them like they would a tree, just part of the land scape.

For socializaton, he only needs to "see the world", that's a good phrase. I am a new owner but I like what workingdogz said.  My breeder/trainer advised taking my new puppy to walk around my neighborhood and go to someplace like Walmart to just sit outside and watch the people and activity, walk him around the parking lot.  She doesn't recommend letting folks pet him (satisfies the human, not the dog since he didn't work for it and I'm all about what's only good for my dog) and no other strange dogs can touch my puppy due to health risks and potential attacking dogs, he gets socialized at puppy play each Saturday after his group training at the breeder/trainer's, we do that for a year.  She specifically said she no longer recommends dog parks or dog beaches, too many irresponsible people bring their dogs to look for a fight and it's too risky. 

If your puppy has to "see the world" in order to be able to cope with any new situation or new environment later in life, then there is something fundamentally wrong with that breeding program. Being able to adjust appropriately and deal with new, changing situations is the hallmark of a temperamentally sound dog. You shouldn't have to train it into them. Besides, if your out there showing your puppy "the world", when are you going to let him experience "life".

Joanro
I certainly don't think any puppy we have raised
'had' to see the world, but because we take our
dogs everywhere with us, it makes easier to let 
them chill from a young age (like sponges then).

It's not a matter of 'training' it in to them, it's a
matter of people actually living with their dogs.
I don't believe it's ideal to 'waste' a pup's youth
by keeping it 'at home' all the time.

But I also don't think I should have to 'work'
on things like stairs etc. They either figure it out,
or they don't. Stairs etc should never be an issue,
but with a puppy with less than stellar nerves,
absolutley they can be.

I do agree though, if we had a puppy/dog that
we **had** to take out and about, well, we
would find it a nice pet home that enjoys a
project dog.

We get our dogs from puppies and move forward
from there, so to get a puppy and then just let it sit
at home for a few months seems pointless. They
learn house manners, how to interact with other
dogs, how to stay the hell out of the kitchen when
the wife is cooking etc.