breeding dogs with demodex is not bettering the - Page 1

breeding dogs with demodex is not bettering the breed also the buyer new nothing about the demodex she brought the pup to the vet wondering why it was loosing its hair

And breeding dogs that have hips that are not certified by OFA due to being a year old is bettering the breed?  You know what they say about glass houses and stones....

my dogs hips are great and i know about throwing stones so why hasn't any one said anything about other people throwing stones

Did her breeding dogs have demodex or just the pup?  I've gotten two pups from two different breeders that broke out with Demodex right after getting here.  STRESS will bring it on.  If you read up on Demodex you will find that every dog carries the mite.  It is NOT yet a proven fact that it is genetic, it is just theory.

I do not care who either of you are and thank god I'm far away from Florida.  I'm just sick of the pissing and moaning going on between buyers and breeders and breeders and breeders and buyers.  Get over yourselves and do your own thing.  You will anyway.  Just don't bitch about the way someone else does it.

Smalldreamso1:    THere sure would be  thousands of bloodlines scratched and the page here is not big enough to list every dog that has had dermadectic...   you need to research before you post such wrong info.....Go to 30 schutzhund clubs in USA and Germany and ask about dermadectic.......I can name 25 dogs of top dogs that have had a small dose of it....it is from dog that has several different immune breakdowns because the pup is either high high drive and is in a new environment and has the weaken immunity and needs some time to recover with good diet and either the choice of Ivemec treatment or let nature take its coarse with hign doses of Omega 3   6 and vit E andf Vit  Ester C,,,,raw meat  , salmon , bison and fish oils....Has nothing to do with bettering the breed.........Im sure the Owner of Isks v Kapbush and Lago v Orthskern  would not put their dogs down or quit breeding Iska because one of her high drive ,,and I mean a very intense girl  had Dermadectic at 10 months  old.....and hundreds of other well bred dogs of the gsd breed........

A lot of American vets   have given people the wrong Ideas about this pesky immune problem....talk to schutzhund people and club trainers.....Years ago the vets  told people to put down any female that had any of her pups with demodectic.....sure would be a bare spot in the dog registry if all had done that....foolish suggestion..  I have never know any fe male to continually birth pups that show the tendency .....very high drive pups are the very ones that usually end up  a bout of it......no biggy...  Usually are never bothered ever again ,,,,,because you make sure the diet of a pup that is high and may have an immune breakdown  in a top diet to control any return of it...

You really have to take into consideration if the puppy has lacalized or generalized demodex. Localized means some isolate spots of hair loss, usually on the muzzle or around the eyes, but it can be elsewhere. There is no secondary bacterial infection and the areas clear up with or without meds. Generalized is a very differenet disease, the dog has significant hair loss and developes a ssecondary bacterial infection that makes it scratch 24/7. All dogs have demodex mites on their bodies at all times - ALL DOGS. They are passed to the whelps via their dams after birth.

Puppies with normal immune systems are able to defend againt these mites causing problems and they suffer either no hair loss at all or some will have a few localized patches mostly brought about be the stress of  a new home, training or the like. Dog that can't fight off the mites will develope generalized demodex and they are the ones that will need the ivermectin and antibiotics, etc.. All generalized cases of demodex begin as localized cases, so there is always the chance that even small spots will lead to big problems in some pups.

This is not a parasitic disease, it is a disease of the autoimmune sytem. It is very likely that a dog and/or a bitch that has produced cases of generalized demodex will continue to produce more pups that are immune deficient and they will be prone to develping generalized demodex. Any dog that has been cured of generalized demodex should never be used for breeding. Before Ivermectin, this was a horrible disease to deal with and the majority of pups with generalized demodex were PTS and the parents withheld from future breeding. Now that it is  relatively curable,  it seems that it is being trivilialized as just one of those things....so what...give the pup Ivermectin and he will be OK.  It's this sort of thinking that is gettng many breeds into trouble, not just this one. Continuing to use dogs that have laready produced pups with generalized demodex is putting more immune cripples into the gene pool and those dogs will not only produce more generalized demodex, they will also produce progeny with other autoimmune diseases - allergies and systemic lupus for examples.

You guys, just make sure when you're busy throwing stones at each other
that your dogs don't swallow any!

Now that can lead to a serious operation!

Ad photo of puppy with probable demodex:

I think that there may be considerably more involved in demodex than we know. I recall when a member of my former (now defunct) club imported a bitch pup from Germany who received a rabies vaccine prior to shipping (despite the fact that she was ~3 months old). When she arrived in the USA, she had to have another damned rabies vaccine because her German one was not accepted here.

Probably a result of vaccinosis, this pup developed pretty bad demodex--requiring Ivermectin and antibiotics. This was an unusually resistent for of demodex that was contagious to other dogs who used the same sleeve or puppy tug. Many unrelated young dogs from ~7  homes came down with demodex. Even dogs in the same households (that did not ever come to club training) developed demodex.

While this may all be anecdotal, I feel that it is signifcant that my own male pup did not develop demodex. Why not? Stangely enough, he did not share the club's bite equipment with the other young dogs. I brought my own bite equipment to club training because when my little Geronimo carried his "reward" to the van, he held onto it for "forever" (15-20 minutes--which would have delayed club training) before finally dropping it and jumping into the crate.

I did not wish to create conflict (and munchiness) by forcing him him to out before he was deveopmentally ready for an "inducive" out. While he would willing out his toys on command or trade for food, he refused to out the puppy bite roll or sleeve until he was ~19 months old..

BTW, in the photo posted above, the pup appears to have "generalized" demodex--multiple lesions on face and all 4 feet (including one hock). Definitely, a candidate for Ivomec and antibiotics.

I guess such a photo implies "truth in advertising" here on the PDB.

Poor little girl--she is adorable!

Blitzen: Continuing to use dogs that have laready produced pups with generalized demodex is putting more immune cripples into the gene pool and those dogs will not only produce more generalized demodex, they will also produce progeny with other autoimmune diseases - allergies and systemic lupus for examples.

Unlikely that VA sire will be withheld from future breeding.

the main thing is I posted that all dogs stated to be OFA good

were not to be found on the site

of smalldreams/mcseaton kennel

where as the kennel owner/breeder

wrote a 'seperate' message  stating for a fact that I  emmagrace/berg quella

sold a dog with mange/ and buyer won in court against me

which I no such buyer ever contacted me NOR was I ever served for any court

why are we argueing about Mange when NO one has stated I sold a dog with mange???

small dream said ''someone called her and told her, she doesnt know who called her''

???????????

there should be no conversation or defense of mange, as there is no buyer

with a dog/pup ever gotten with mange from me :)

but thanks for all the replies on mange, much more info than I had ever heard of

appreciate it

emmagrace