Critcal Mass...... - Page 1

Pedigree Database

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

by wscott00 on 21 February 2008 - 20:02

So when i started schutzhund i was extremely impressed by any dog that had a sch title. I also thought that any dog w/ a sch3 had to be the best of the best.

latley ive been going back out to training and visiting other clubs (after a yr of not training) and ive noticed folks getting ready for spring trials..  the only thing is these are folks who will be trying for the 2nd or 3rd time to pass protection.  these dogs have failed because they wont stay in the blind or come off the sleeve during the stick hits etc...

it just seems that weaker and weaker dogs are being allowed to get titles these days.  i understand that its a large sport and most folks just have fun but at what point do we reach a critcal mass where the titles are so easy they are worthless.

it will never happen but i think you should only be allowed to earn a sch3 at a regional event.  this will allow the weaker dogs earn 1 and 3 but make sure that dogs that earn a sch3 deserve it.  and by deserve it i mean havnet failed 3 or 4 times in the bite work for not engaging or passed on thier home field w/ the home helper.

is anyone else concerned about the quality of dog that reach sch3????


by Speaknow on 21 February 2008 - 20:02

Good points well put, scott. Train any dog expertly and long enough and almost any outcome is achievable - proving what? Reminds me a bit of overcoming gun shyness by exposing the animal weekly to gunshots!

by wscott00 on 21 February 2008 - 21:02

im just sick of seeing weak dog pass after 3 tries at their home field, tracking trackt the home track layer has laid, and being babies along in the trial by thier home helper.

 

 


by Puputz on 21 February 2008 - 21:02

Another thought...does anyone else think that the BH is perhaps weeding out the very strong dogs?


4pack

by 4pack on 21 February 2008 - 21:02

Exposing your dogs to weekly gunshots? Seems a little exesive, even wastefull.  Only takes one good shot to get a dog over being gun shy.

As far as the OP is concerned, never judge a dog by his titles, unless you have seen him perform  for them. I owned a Schutzhund 3 female that I could never get to work for me. 


by wscott00 on 21 February 2008 - 21:02

exactly 4pack, sch 3 are being earned by such weak dogs we can only divide by the lowest common demoninator.  unless we've seen them.  thats why id like to see everyone earn a sch3 at a regional event.  that way we know there is a minimum level the dog met.  vs all the stars being aligned at a club trial.


by Speaknow on 21 February 2008 - 21:02

I've seen it done at weekly training sessions prior to survey, 4pack, for unduly nervy dogs.

habanaro

by habanaro on 21 February 2008 - 23:02

I guess I have to politley disagree.  I think if we were to do that we would never advance any trial helpers to a national level and the trial helpers ability would be eroded at the regional level. I have what I would consider a club level dog and if he is going to flunk protection he is not going to out.  I can think of some people that have more powerful dogs that I have seen not out on a national level helper before.  If you were to limit sch 3's to only regional levels and above I think that to some extent you would limit some of the power dogs attaining this level as well.

I enjoy showing my dogs even if at times I don't do so well.  Another big part of getting a schutzhund 3 is your skills as a handler.  Club trials are a great place to hone your skill as well as your dogs.

Jeff G

 

 


by wscott00 on 22 February 2008 - 00:02

im not saying limiting sch3 to regional and above, im saying you could only earn a 3 at a regional level.  dogs that do not out would be dismissed just like dogs that don not engaged would be dismissed.  you can train your dog to out, and pass at a regional level.  while the dog that needs to be on his home fiedl w. his home helper will not pass.

as far a helpers go, i dont think it would affect helper development at all.  there will still be sch3's performed at the club level.  those that need to qualilfy for nationals, those that already have a 3 and like to show their dogs, or those that are getting ready for a 3 at aregional level. 

there needs to be a minimum standard for sch 3

at the end of the day strong dogs will rise to the top, but we need to make sure the weak dogs fall to the bottom.


by hodie on 22 February 2008 - 03:02

I disagree completely. Just because a trial is local does not mean that it is not held to the same standards as a regional. The tasks are EXACTLY the same. We have had excellent judges here and I have trialed in many locations in and out of state. Not many people do that and I cannot do it any longer.

I have also taken a dog to the USA Sieger Show where she did outstanding protection work. Her SchH3 came on her own home field, but she can go to any field and I guarantee she will do the work and it does not matter who the helper is. We have multiple helpers come in to work our dogs because we have no helper in the club and few people work their dogs against as many as we have.

There IS a minimum standard for SchH 3 already and it is in the rules. If what you are seeing is not what you consider SchH3 level work, then there is a disconnect somewhere.  However, don't penalize everyone because in your area you think there is a problem. Maybe there is, maybe not. People cheat, people fudge, and yes, judges are more lax here or there according to their own interpretations of the rules.

I have no desire to compete at regionals or nationals because I run a business and I cannot go elsewhere easily. We have already set so many obstacles for so many of us who want to participate in the sport that we continue to shoot ourselves in the foot. The SchH community grows smaller each year. Minimum standards are one thing, but to try to make it so difficult that people cannot participate serves no one, including the dogs or the sport as a whole.

At the end of the day the strong dogs do rise, where ever they are. And yes, the weak dogs often fall. Are there some who get passed at any level who perhaps should not? Well, in my opinion, that is up to the judges and if you have a beef, that is where you should go with it. Don't try to say others have to compete per your rules when we are competing by THE rules already.






 


Contact information  Disclaimer  Privacy Statement  Copyright Information  Terms of Service  Cookie policy  ↑ Back to top