Social Aggression - Page 1

Rather than hijacking someone's thread I thought I'd post new.

Can someone please define social aggresstion, is it a desirable trait...or another sophisticated term to excuse poor temperament?

Thanks,

Melanie

Sorry for the typo

Social agression??? Hmmm that's an interesting question Melanie. lol  If I read that or heard the phrase I myself would interpret it to mean that dog has temperment issues, likely a nerve problem and I'd definately not excuse poor temperment as that is my #1 criteria when selecting a dog for myself. 

If someone were advertising a dog with social agression I'd say they were trying to dance around the poor temperment and nerve issue.  Kinda sounds like they're trying to be honest but not too honest really because they need to move this dog and possibly hope that whoever would overlook this problem would associate it as a training issue that can be "fixed"??? 

It's too early for me to think much deeper.  Only on my second cup of coffee. lol

A good definition can be found here: http://www.workingdogs.com/dom1.htm

I have read the above web-site on "Social Aggession" and although I agree on the first sentence...I don't necessilarly agree on the rest of the post...My definition of "Social Aggression" is the formation of the pack and how each member reacts towards one another...It is how the pack is formed and how the hierarchy is formulated...

"Social Aggression" does not mean how they fight...but only how they react to one another in different everyday situations...In my pack there is only one dominating member....and that's me...from that point on there are other members of the pack that are in line of dominance but are not the leader...

I have a number of German Shepherds and I let a lot of them run together when they come out of their runs...I do this for a number of reasons...First off I would be there all day if I would only take one dog out at a time...Second...It's absolutely nesessary for them to run together and have a pack and to learn from each other...good and bad...they learn so much from each other that there's just no way I could teach them these things...Third...It lets the young dogs develope their skills with each other and with more mature dogs...When I have a number of dogs out together I throw them 1 ball or 1 kong...and let everyone go after it...will fights break out...of course there will...but very rarely do any of them get hurt in these...It's a necessary part of growing up and being able to cope with different situations...Fourth...When I see that a dog is getting into the pack too much...and follows the other dogs too much...then I will spent more time...one-on-one with this dog...and you can really see a difference in him/her after just one short session...

I have had "low ball drive" dogs before...and I let them come out and run with a very high drive...dominant dog...and eventually the "low ball drive" dog will also want the toy and go after it...and in time they will begin to improve on the drives....

"Social Aggression" is a very necessary part of growing up and a important piece to the puzzle of life...Is it necessary to have great Social Aggression to be a Schutzhund Dog...No of course not...but It Is an important part of growing up and understanding their position in life and to have a very well rounded personality...

~Bob~

"Social aggression is the dog's desire to establish pack hierarchy (alpha/leader). It is also another instinct which is not critical for Schutzhund protection training. However, it is an instinct which can give the dog an added strength because it is not reactive aggression (defense/self-preservation) and, therefore, it does not have the potential disadvantage of flight behavior. Since social aggression has no flight counterpart, the dog does not perform under the same level of stress as in reactive aggression.

Social aggression is characterized by a dog that demonstrates a deep grumbling bark. This type of dog also generally expresses itself in a very dominant manner. Social aggression is almost exclusively a male characteristic. It can be the determining factor in a protection dog successfully facing a life threatening situation (i.e., police dog, personal protection dog, military dog, etc.).

As breeders/trainers, we stress a mild level of social aggression because the potential drawback of an excessive level of social aggression is constant struggle for authority thereby hampering trainability."

Quoted from http://www.workingdogs.com/dom1.htm

I like a dash of social aggression.

I'm very happy to see these links laid out for others. Social Aggression is not a bad phrase Agar, not a bad trait either. Baden has a good helping of SA and you want your dogs to have some too.

Well now see THIS is what the board should be used for.  I was TOTALLY off base with my assumption of what social aggression even was and I learned something new today. lol  Thanks guys!

And who said the database wasn't the learning experience it once was.   I just came from a thread of that nature.

This is good information for all to share, thanks.

Social aggresstion related to protection is basically the dogs WILLINGNESS to bring on the fight.  He is not engaging the helper out of prey movement.  He is not hackled or fanged up ( possible defensive responce) when the decoy squares to him in a challenge.  He welcomes the challenge and seeks to dominate the helper.

Mel, Andy has nice social aggression in protection work.  But Andy is also that special dog that has that on off switch.

Koos Hassing of Tiekerhook kennels is big on social aggression.  Many of his dogs are for real dogs and not for novice handlers.  Cut and paste the link below.  the dog at about the 2 min 30 sec count displays nice SA as well as the dog that follows.  Hope this helps.

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/koos-hassing-tiekerhook-seminar-segment-2/3046124250

Kyle