breeders/rescue groups - Page 1

i'm curious about how many breeders on this database who also do rescue. not just rehoming one of their own pups/dogs, but taking in a "strange" gsd? shelley strohl helped place a gsd with jackie's (kalibeck) family and molly (eichenluft) took in another dog. i give some  financial aid to a gsd rescue group in southern cal, but one person i've dealt with has stated that "breeders are the problem". now, bad breeders or just breeders in general? and, if they love the breed, wouldn't they be more supportive of the good breeders out there? i understand being negative about crappy breeders, i think we can all agree on that, but , without responsible breeders out there, would we even have the gsd in a decade? breed specific rescues should work with the good breeders in their locale, and not blame them across the board for the tragically big numbers of dogs needing good homes. and, should good breeders try to get involved in rescue groups to help out? we have one rescue and one purebred and i'll probably try to do that for the rest of my life, although, as i get older, even tho i LOVE the puppy stage, older dogs would probably be the better bet. btw, i also will provide for any/all dogs i have in the case of my extreme disability or death.

i've noticed lately that some people recommend rescues instead of breeder dog for some posters and of course, there are any number of posters who have only rescue gsds.

Iam a breeder and i took in last year a 10 year old blk/silv female gsd, you can see her on my website http://vomhausvianden.tripod.com just go to other dogs she  is on that page.I will also always take my dogs or puppies that i bred back.Two weeks ago i rescue a cocker from a shelter in Washington and still trying to get the gsd that he was with out. The shelter is not sure want there going to do with the gsd.they pick her up after she attack and injury the other dog she was living with.She was one of my pups i sold four years ago to a friend and she let her x husband take the dogs.It just make me sick that they won't let me get her out of there. Any help Shelly or Molly that would be great.

I am also a breeder i do rescue and we did over 15 dogs in 2007. Not all were GSDs some were other breeds. We just pulled a female GSD preg with black lab puppies becase she was going to be put to sleep. Vary sad were are taking donations to pay for her spay as soon as the pups are weaned and if we can raises enugh we will have the pups spayed before they leave also . If not then there will be a spay/ neuter contract....

I rarely breed. The reason for not doing so in spite of having some excellent dogs is that I have done GSD rescue for more than 10 years. I see the dogs no one wants but a breeder sold just because it was good money to take from someone. Too many do not care where they place a dog or whether it is a good match with a given purchaser. And sure, sometimes mistakes, honest mistakes, are made in placement as people wanting a dog are not always truthful. And yes, sometimes people have a good reason to need to give a dog up. But mostly they don't. All of a sudden the dog is too much trouble, bit someone, killed another animal, jumps the fence, barks all the time, is too much to handle, is too much trouble and so forth. I could go on here, but I will spare you.

What I will tell you is that there are probably more than a hundred GSD breeders in this state alone. Unfortunately, most do not take their own dogs back, let alone any GSD in need. The shelters are full of GSDs, and if the dog shows the least amount of trouble, the dogs are put down. As for breeders helping people who do rescue, they are few and far between.I know of one in this state who writes on the website that they donate the purchase price of one pup from each litter to rescue. As far as I and others know, this is pure bunk.

Most breeders want nothing to do with rescues, especially those who call them to task for their lack of concern. A SINGLE breeder in this state has donated to my GSD rescue program. ONE breeder and she did it ONE time. She is also one of the FEW breeders I know in the state who take dogs back without question. So yes, there are some ethical breeders, but not on every corner. Most talk a big line, but it is more a big lie.

I fund my rescue out of my own pocket. In some years in the recent past I spent more than $40,000 on vet bills, surgery for hip replacements and broken limbs, other medical care, food and housing.  Sometimes someone who has been a long time friend will make a donation here or there but it is a pittance compared to the real costs. It is expensive to house, feed and care for even a single rescue, let alone the numbers I sometimes have had. I just had to put one rescue down last year after keeping her for many years. Just to put her down cost more than $100. Over the years I have placed probably at least 450 and maybe one third of those have been in my care, sometimes for a few months, and in several cases, for several years until I could find the right match. I have several rescues still who will likely live out their lives here, but now that I am older, without health insurance and running a business which is unpredictable in terms of income, I have to be realistic and I simply cannot take all the dogs I am called about, even those without serious issues.

At the moment I do not take dogs in, but at least 10-15 times every few weeks I am trying to help people place their dogs, help with training and behavior issues, and sometimes just telling owners like it is (that placement of their old GSD they now want to abandon probably means the dog will be put down) can make a difference. But most of the time, the dogs I cannot accept are dumped in shelters. I am not tooting my own horn, but I think you asked and you should have an honest answer.

Breeders don't like being taken to task by people like me, Shelly or others here who have helped. So the bottom line is simple. They continue to produce litter after litter after litter (some of my rescues come from these so called "reputable" and "admired" breeders) and they do NOTHING to help anyone in anyway who is trying to make a difference. But no one wants the truth and maybe no one here wants to hear this either.

nobody ever said the truth had to be comfortable. i do appreciate what you've done and said here. it makes me feel a bit better knowing that any money i give the rescue group keeps a dog from being euthanized. i had to give one up and while she was placed fairly quickly, i feel an obligation to help the people who helped her. i know that some people simply take the money and run, but surely it is in their own best interest to help with rescues? so much legislation in so many states regarding mandatory spay/neuter and licensing that i'd think they'd want to help police themselves more? i admire those who already have dogs and a program and training, etc who still find the time, money and effort to make a difference and correct someone else's mistake.

thanks to vianden, hodie, weberhaus, shelley and any and all others.

angusmom,

You bring up an important topic and one I speak out about all the time. This too makes me unpopular with many, not that I care.

The fact is that we who supposedly love the breed, or any breed for that matter, should be taking things more seriously and instead of always reacting to BSLs etc with knee jerk reactions, should be much, much more proactive at the most elementary level. This begins with the breeders, breed organizations, clubs etc. If there is a breeders code of ethics in a given organization, it is, for the most part, a joke and no one enforces it in any way.

No one will tackle such issues head on. And so too many animals roam the streets, bite people, bark, and cause mayhem and the general public gets tired of it. Then some politician, meaning well, jumps forward with punitive legislation that will not solve the problem. The problem begins with each and every one of us who ever bred a single litter. But even on this forum I bet soon we will hear from those who say once they have bred and sold the dog, they have no further responsibility. I strongly disagree with that position.

We should be doing more to educate breeders. We should be doing more to educate the buying public. We should all, as breeders or sellers of dogs, make certain the person we sell or adopt to is qualified and capable of owning the dog. But no, we don't do most of this and if anyone speaks out on these issues, all hell breaks loose. There are breeders who have been mentioned here and elsewhere as "stellar" who frankly are part of the problem churning out a hundred or more dogs a year (and keeping many of them in plastic crates for most of the day). There are breeders who sell unhealthy dogs, but who blame the new owner for the illness of the pup. But no one will help these people, feret out these breeders or speak out.

We should be doing more to educate the public about the responsibilities that can and should be expected of breeders and dog owners.  Society has a right to not have problems with dogs. And if we do not find a way to be more proactive rather than simply try to fight BSL, I guarantee there will come a day when there will be more onerous regulation of dogs and dog owners and breeders than we can even envision.

There are many things that could be done, but no one gives a damn. Further, let anyone suggest we should deal with the attendant problems and all these same breeders come out of the woodwork as if their very livelihood depended on it (and in all too many, it does). I am sure I will get a lot of heat for this post, but it needs to be said and I have said it before and will say it again.

I have done Rescue for 13 years now. I have many Rescue people & groups who will not "trust" me because they think I may want to breed any intact blk/tan dog, talk behind my back, etc. I do not care, they are the same people/groups I don't want to share with anyway. Actually I have been rescueing MUCH longer than breeding.

Simply, my life revolves around the breed

I'm with K9mom - I've been "doing" GSD and all-breed rescue for 13 years  now - as long as I've been breeding GSDs.  NONE of the rescues have been from my own breeding, and I don't consider pups I occasionally get back because they don't fit into their family for various reasons, rescues.  My rescues have all been abandoned, or dogs needing to be rehomed due to behavior problems or circumstances requiring the dog to be rehomed.  To date I've lost count how many dogs have come in and out of my "doors" but I'm sure it's in the 50's (GSDs) and if you count other breeds, maybe 100's.  More recently there was Roscoe, kept in a 10X10 pen for his entire 9 years old life, chained to his doghouse inside his pen and forced to sleep in puddles on wet days - the first time he stood on the grass was the day I got him out.  I also got slightly bitten trying to get his chain off and leash on, since his owners wouldn't approach him outside the pen.  Rosco due to his age and temperament was kept by the "official" GSD rescue organization who assisted me in getting him out of his cage - where he still lives today.  Then there was "Bear" - another one kept in a 10X10 pen on the asphalt driveway of his family's home, so that he could bark when someone approached the house.  Food was put through the cage wire and water hosed in.  He stood on hot/melting asphalt and feces until I got him out.   Sam was a big black boy, tied to a tree in the backyard when his owner got a new St. Bernard puppy and was only allowed to keep one dog in the house.  She brought the St. for boarding here and lamented about her "other dog" left at home where the landlord could "throw him food once in a while" when she was away.  I convinced her to release Sam to me - turned out to be a nice dog placed in a home with children where he is living the good life now.  Prince was another one tied to a tree, saw him driving along one day and was able to rescue him.  Maximus (the 1st) was released to me by his owner due to small-dog aggression, and stayed with me for months until I was able to place him with a police-dog trainer who is getting him ready for narcotics certification, and placing with a police handler.  Maxiumus/Blackie I  have now hopefully will become a PP or corrections dog.  And many others.  I try my best to make myself and my kennel available for dogs in need, not just GSDs but of course that is my breed of choice, so the one I am most interested in helping out.  I always wonder when I see these dogs come in, that were obviously bred by someone, raised for 8 weeks by someone - where is that someone?  Don't they care where the dogs they produced are?  I don't understand that.

molly

so, what would the steps to a realistic solution be? i hate more laws, the ones we have should be sufficient, but there is no money for people to enforce the laws. should breeders also be "encouraged" to include training or referrals for training? i feel lucky because the breeders where i got angus are also trainers and they offer classes or training for your pup before you pick him/her up. we had claire inboard trained while i dealt and trained my gsd that i had to surrender and later, we took classes with angus and claire. i know not all breeders train their dogs. should they also be certified trainers? how do you police this? there should be equal responsibility between buyer and breeder, but, normally, a buyer is getting one dog and a breeder may have any number, so what then? if a breeder sells a pup or dog with even basic training, the price goes up (and rightly so, it takes work). how do you ensure that a buyer follows thru and gives the animal even the basics of good training (obedience). do you think rescue people do more training than breeders in general? i admire those who try to produce a really good gsd AND take their time to take in and place those dogs who need a new home. i'm just wondering, because of different legislations in different states (the US), but also, in other countries, how we can try, as owners, rescuers and breeders of the gsd to make sure that we don't get "legislated" out of existence?

I started my work with GSDs by doing rescue.  Didn't buy my 1st breeding dog until I'd been doing rescue for 10 years.  I still do rescue, not just my own but others as well.

Sue-Ann