Anybody Interested in a Trade?? - Page 7

Jenn, that is the dumbest thing about the off leash fear.  They weren't in the know, for sure. I understand about the size thing. I wonder what the cuttoff size is?

 DDR-DSH:
I don't have to have a male.
I just thought that my older chow mix female (who is an alpha) would accept a male easier than a female.
Good point about the prospect.
But isn't a dog like your female typically going to cost a lot more money than a younger dog?
I want to do this but I have a limited budget.
Love the name "Dulce".

Sorry, but I cannot completely agree with the concept that "any old dog will do". Yes, I suppose that is true, but they won't "do" much, compared to a dog (of any breed) which is carefully picked for behavioral characteristics. It's really like comparing a Ferrari with a VW bug. Both will get you around, but let's face it.. which would you want? I know for sure what kind of a dog I would want, and what kind of a dog I would want searching for me. 

 I got involved in a little of this SAR stuff, years ago, and sold a bitch pup that went big in SAR back in VA. I went to this one SAR seminar with Urs Ochsenbein up in N. California. What a great guy he was. He was 75 years old, fit and lean, and still working in avalanche rescue. He started the national Swiss avalanche rescue teams in his homeland. Really, one of the great gurus at the time. We're talking twenty years ago, BTW. I think it was January of 1990.

So, he came out and spent many days watching and critiqueing handler / dog teams. There were a LOT there. In the end, final evaluation report, he said that only two dogs there were really suitable to be on a serious team, and that the rest were wasting their time with the dogs they had. Oh, you should have seen the shit hit the fan, then!!!! A mob of extremely pissed off wimmen literally encircled Urs and started to insult and berate him. This was surely one of the most embarassing things I have EVER seen in the dog sport world. They told him that they would NEVER invite him back, again, and he replied by assuring them that he would never come back to help them.

I really lost interest in that whole scene, right about then. Most of the people there were women and girls, and most had taken this up as a sort of hobby.. something to do with the dog they already had. It never occurred to them to pick the right dog for the job, and they rankled at any such suggestion. I wrote them off as something more like soccer mom types, only with "furkids".. basically devoted pet owners with a rescue fantasy.

So, what ticked these people off so badly? Urs told them that they were all doing a great job and working hard, but that they really needed to get better dogs.. that they were limited by the dogs they were trying to work with. The dogs he rated the highest? A gorgeous male Australian merle collie (who was fantastically talented and able to do anything with excellence), and my SchH3 DDR male (who had never done anything like this, before) Candy von der Knappenmühle. Trouble with that was that I had no serious interest in doing SAR work.. This outing for my husband and I was a much needed getaway, right on the heels of our daughter's passing. And, by the way.. Some of these same bitches (human variety) confronted me in a gang of three, demanding to know what I was doing there???? I STILL have no idea what that was all about. It was a public event and I paid my admission fee. The dog world is infested with these idiots.. If I had told them our daughter had just died and we needed to be 250 miles from home, doing anything but thinking about it, their jaws would have dropped. I doubt they would have sense to be embarassed, though.

 Jen:
Thanks.

DDR-DSH;
Who said anything about any old dog will do for K9 SAR work??

clc29...

  At one time in life (before a series of financial and legal disasters befell me), my goal with dogs was purely philanthropic. That really hasn't changed much. I still want to do philanthropic work with dogs, but I'm a lot less able to afford it, now. I can place some pups for free with the right people, if I am assured that they will follow a program and give back. To hold onto a dog through it's growing months and spend time training it is another matter. And, the dogs eat. I have to get something for the very few that I have to offer. I don't want to cheat the ones I keep out of anything that they need. It's not about profit. I have no profit incentive with the dogs. 

  You don't see the really good ones too often. It's the same with anything you want to do with animals. Some are born with a potential that others just don't have. Zenyatta is running at Santa Anita this Sunday, and my husband wants to go see her. I find it hard to justify, time wise, but I would like to say that I looked upon Thoroughbred greatness. I have seen her pictures.. She's the picture of perfection, anatomically. But that is not what makes her great, I think. If I look in her eyes, I see something that I don't see in other horses. 90% of the potential for greatness is in the spirit of an animal. Most animals can be great in their own way.. Just being a trustworthy family pet is really maybe the highest calling, after all. But only a few are imbued with a spirit and a will to do certain things.

  Finding the ones that are best suited for certain kinds of jobs is a matter of testing, to a great degree. I know what I'm looking for and what to expect of certain bloodlines, and I test the pups in some very basic ways that tell me in a moment what I can expect of that pup. From there, it's a matter of nurturing and building to develop the full potential. I'm kicking myself a bit with Dulce, because I could have spent more time with her when she was younger. But she got a LOT of socialization and imprinting as a pup, and her progress in training now is really phenomenal. I think she really is one of those special ones.

By the way.. I forgot to mention, that Dulce was going to be my personal pick for a keeper, with the hope to breed her, eventually. It happened by luck that she came up missing a lower right premolar, which was considered a breed fault in the DDR. So, I washed her out of my plans in a breeding program. She's better off being a working dog, anyway. She has an extremely active mind and needs to be challenged with some kind of task. She's a really fast learner. She's spoiled and bratty, right now, but I'm working with her on a motivational basis, now. I want her to be able to work completely autonomously in the search work, or as near complete as possible. She's already progressed to where I'm introducing her to directed searches. What I don't want is a dog that's looking to me for guidance, first. She must be able to do it, herself. That's why she has the nose, and I don't. LOL
She's really a LOT of fun to train and watch, as she learns. I just love her confidence and insane level of motivation. When I take her out to work, I have to wrestle with her to get her leash on. She loves this SO much, and cannot wait to go! She makes me smile, inside, just thinking about her!

Moons,
I will try to get some pictures of my appaloosa this weekend and see if she qualifies in your book!
We use to show quarter horses and appaloosas in western pleasure. Did pretty good. Stood a superior in WP stud for many years-own son of Zippo Pine Bar. He was amazing.
You could not tell the difference between many of our solid apps and the quarter horses-same conformation.

Another example of showing ruining a breed.  

clc29

No offense, but just to ask the question you just did indicates to me that you are maybe more interested in controversy and drama. Without knowing it, you just left a calling card. I think you want to stir the pot a bit. I'm not interested in creating trouble. I'm just stating my opinion, and I agree with Urs Ochsenbein, even if my opinion might be construed as "impolite", by some. To say that a dog just needs a nose to do good search work is like saying that a horse only needs four legs to run (and ostensibly win a derby). This is both true, and untrue. Theory and reality can be worlds apart.
I'm in no rush to place Dulce. I want her to be well matched for the home she goes to. If I didn't think she was a good prospect, I would not have mentioned her in this context. Interpretation.. I don't want to oversell her, or undersell her. I'm a big believer in "underpromise and over-deliver". So, I don't want to overplace her.. And, I don't want to underplace her, either.
Woops.. Coffee break over. Got to get back to work..

Steph, I nominate you to start a horse thread. I will if you won't. Now we have 2 distinct branches in this thread, and I want to keep up w/the horse branch w/out taking away from Cheri's SAR questions.

Cheri, again, before you get too confused and discouraged, I really don't think you will have a hard time finding a dog to do what you want. It's too bad that people breed crap dogs you have to weed through; I admit that. ANY well balanced dog who shows the aptitude (somewhat subjective term- sorry) and is in good health and has good structure for endurance and physical work should make you a nice partner.

I have a male that would work great for you....too bad I don't think I could part with him again ( I sold him when I had no choice and now he's coming home- YAY!)

It's too bad, really, that you have to be so particular. People forget the GSD was supposed to be a versatile, service-oriented dog. Sad when you have to ask particular questions to be sure you're getting a GSD who can track!