BH........is it a "Title" - Page 5

My screen shows my post being extended too far to the right and being covered by the menu bar. Just checking if thios post has the same problem.

Molly wrote: <<If anyone is interested in a more educated answer, I can ask Ulf Kintzell about it.>>

Regarding HGH dogs being exempt from the BH, there is no short answer: It should be seen in a different way. It should be seen in the chronological order. First, there was an HGH title. Then a SchH title/test was created. Obedience was assumed when professional shepherds titled their dogs simply because all training was done off leash anyway and at first only professional people obtained HGH titles. Then, after the creation of a SchH title and with the introduction of hobby people attempting to title a dog, the need to first prove that the dog is sound and obedient arose.

So, it is not so much that the dog in an HGH trial is exempt, it is that a BH was added for dogs attempting a SchH title. After so many years and since some time now the majority of titles obtained are SchH titles (as opposed to very few HGH tile), the perception has been reversed and dogs attempting an HGH title are considered exempt.

The argument could be made that nowadays a fair amount of hobby people attempts obtaining HGH titles and the obedience is at times insufficient. However, the exemption aims at the professional shepherds in Germany who participate in HGH trials.

Furthermore, the BH test has two parts: the obedience part and the temperament test. It is only the obedience part the dog is exempt from. The temperament test is incorporated in the HGH trial. The handler introduces him-/herself to the judge, shakes hand, the tattoo or microchip is tested. If the dog exhibits inappropriate aggressive behavior the dog may not participate in the trial.

PS: The statement that was made that the SV breeding regulations require a breed survey is incorrect. SV minimum breeding regulations require a working title (HGH, SchH, or DPO), a show rating of at least a "Good", and a qualifying hip- and elbow rating. If these requirements are met by both dam and sire the resulting litter will receive white papers. If the parents have both been breed surveyed in addition to these afore mentioned requirements the resulting litter will receive pink papers.

Why when you register your dog here does Confirmation ratings show up as titles?
example copy and paste.

Original Review new data.
Title SG 1 [UNCHANGED]
Name


W

USE A DICTIONARY.....the word referring to structure of the dog is CONFORMATION, not conFIRMATION.....

Look, people are going to breed untitled stock. It happens and we will NEVER stop it. However, said "breeders" have no real right to claim their dogs are correct quality for schutzhund, conformation, or anything else and they really make my blood boil. If you're breeding pets, at least own up and say you're breeding pets, and only pets.

There's nothing wrong with having a dog currently in training for a title...so why not spend your time getting the title instead of making puppies?

If a buyer wants a true to standard dog physically and mentally and they want to support an active breeder, they will buy from titled stock. If Joe Schmoe doesn't give a crap, he'll pick up what he can afford. Fine with me since I think my puppies deserve intelligent, educated owners who do their homework.

It's two different worlds of buyers and dogs and it is what it is.

And NO, a BH is not a title. A CD is more work than a BH.

And NO, a BH is not a title. A CD is more work than a BH.

I've done both and I'd beg to differ.

Keith Jenkins

Oh, I see A TITLE OF STRUCTURE... Thanks for clearing that up, Hodie. 

Max,
I have no problem here.  I have however pissed off Queen bee and her little cronies, by not recognizing that there is only ONE WAY TO DO THINGS, the queen bee way.  If you are not on "board" with that in this board you get harrassed from every corner. 
I had an old saying that should be revived for you:
You don't have to like my dogs.  I love my dogs.  The people that buy my dog LOVE my dogs and their dogs from me.  If you can do better, come on down and give me a little competition.



Of all of the trials I have been to this year, lets see, thats 8 events this year I consitantly, BY JUDGES and others get told my dog is a WONDERFUL dog and has a SOUND MIND and BODY.  He is limited by me only and I am learning and trialing him as I learn.  

Here is an idea, Lets all put up pictures of our Breeding stock working or showing, then WE CAN CRITIQUE EACHOTHER.  I'll bet 90% of the population in this place declines the invite.     

W 

I had never heard the parenthetical thing. WOW.

IMO, THAT is extremely dishonest. If you're breeding untitled dogs, have the balls to stand up and say you're doing it (at least to prospective buyers), and say why. Sure, you will catch a lot of nastiness, but if you have a clear conscience that there is good reason to breed untitled dogs due to circumstance, whatever...then do it and OWN IT! Don't deliberately mislead people with a set of freaking parentheses. That's terrible. You know damn well most people don't know what the hell that means.

Shoot, I guess here again, I'm missing the boat. Gotta go now- I have a few dogs whose title entries I need to change to (SchH1) LMAO.

"And NO, a BH is not a title. A CD is more work than a BH."

"I've done both and I'd beg to differ."

I've done both too and had the same thought.  I do think that any dog should be able to easily get both, but coming from an AKC background, I was stunned that in the BH and in SchH, your dog can totally blow an exercise and still pass if you have sufficient total points.  That just amazed me and I thought wow, this is MUCH easier than AKC.  I was also really surprised that it's "once and done," whereas in AKC obedience you must pass on 3 separate occasions under 3 separate judges in order to get a title.  So yes, for those two things alone, the BH is easier.

For example, when I was watching my first BH the dog did not sit in the Sit Out of Motion, but stood, and I thought, oh, too bad, he failed.  But of course he did not.  In AKC that would be a failure and you would have to do the test another day.  Plus for BH and SchH you can give additional Fuss commands when you change pace and not be deducted points for doing it, plus in AKC the Long Sit and Down are with other dogs often VERY close to your dog, plus you're not out there in the middle of a field, but usually in a very crowded area with people right near the ring gates - people with dogs, little children with food...many more distractions than out on a BH field.

Again, not negating BH's in any way, I think they're great.  Just saying that I understand the statement KCzaja made.

Ok...we got the BH thing all straightened out...thanks for all the help from those that responded......I wish those other 3 questions would get answered too.......Hint...:) I would appreciate anyones responses...with out the fighting please. I was amazed at how many breeders I found on here that only have a BH on there dogs...yet breed and sell the Pup's...and some I have actually watched on here state how one should not breed a GSD without the proper Titles.....It really makes it hard when a person shows up on our board here...not being "Educated" in all the practices going on out there and they get jumped on for buying a piece of crap Pup (Stated sometimes) and yet when one trys to get honest straight answers....it's like pulling teeth....sometimes....oh well Live and Learn...thanks again for all the help from those who jumped in!! I'll back out of this thread now while I still have 10 fingers and 10 toes.....Thanks!