Information on Breeding Dutch Shepherds - Page 4

I swear it's not me!!

Uh- huh...

Dawulf & Jen  LOL


Apple - to answer your question "How well do I think the dogs @ Westminster 
(Show) can perform the tasks they were bred for ?":   I DON'T.  


When did any GSD entrant at the nations's premier venue for AKC ever do any
proper work ?  These are like the UK's "Alsatians" (thankfully a less influential
force these days), bred almost purely for their Show qualities. [And even then
one can argue about their definition of correct structure !]   Even directly
imported dogs from [W] Germany, if they make it to Westminster, even if things
are slightly changing these days, they are not looking for good working specimens
of the breed...


But Westminster IS NOT THE BE-ALL & END-ALL OF BREEDING REGISTERED
DOGS (even, actually, 'Show' dogs).  Even in America.  And certainly not in Europe.

I was not just referring to GSDs at Westminster, but all the breeds, which were originally bred for some type of task or work.  They are all bred to the standard to a tee, but I'm confident most are mediocre at best in performing what they were originally bred for.  Thus my point, that breeding for the standard, results in the temperament and working abilities of a breed deteriorating.  I think this even applies to WL GSDs.

Apple, breeding for the standard would not be a problem, IF, people bred for it. The standard of most dogs calls for a WORKING animal, not a "pet". Most people today cannot handle a working animal, but, they like the way it looks, so, some breeders took that to heart and have littered the planet with useless dogs that "look good" but cannot get out of their own way....its like getting a Lamborghini with a Yugo engine and exhaust system. Several years a go, I happen to catch a glimpse of the Westminister while the fox terrier was being introduced and the announcer was telling everyone about the breed..."The fox terrier was ONCE bred to hunt foxes and it WAS a fantastic hunting dog...TODAY, its being bred for its BRILLIANT COLORS. At that moment, they should have shut down the show and arrested everyone involved with it for destroying every breed in that building, alas, it was not like that.
 

LOL Hired Dog @ that Fox Terrier story.   You are right, although you & I may
disagree about the type and degree of 'working ability' and how it is measured,
at least you seem aware there are many different breeding programmes out in
the big wide world, and many different debates about exactly how the GSD
should be, both in abilities  and conformation.

Apple just seems to think that all people with any preference for pure-bred stock are 
following exactly the same path.   This is no more true of the German Shepherd
Dog than it is of the Border Collie.  With both breeds, there are folk on the extremes,
at one end thinking it is all about work, and at the other that it is all about meeting the
requirements of a body like the AKC.    In the real world, Apple, there are far more of
us somewhere in the middle of that spectrum - who are aware of Max's demand that we
keep the GSD a 'working' dog [even where there are different interpretations of what 'work'],
but who are also aware for instance that he at no point said it should stop being capable
of being versatile (eg, as it worked out, for tasks like Seeing-Eye), or of being used for herding.                
 
The working people who have subsequently developed 'bitework' to the point so many of them
are so disproportionately proud of, have exceeded that remit, to the point where they want dogs
that frankly are no longer properly suitable for those other jobs.  And are getting them.

In my opinion, they are just as guilty of doing a disservice to the GSD breed as those who
strive to breed pretty-pretty 'Shepherds',  with zero drives to inconvenience their 'couch potato'
owners.  Both extremes can "pack up their tents" as far as many of us are concerned;  the
Mali-mixture people are welcome to the ones at their end !

I'd prefer GSDs to continue to be bred according TO the original German Standard, or at the
least to the current FCI one;  NOT the watered down AKC, or UK's KC, versions.   And I also
want to keep the type of Shows I attend in England, which are different from mainstream 
American Shows [ more like the UKC version ?], as they are different from our Crufts ... and
the record keeping that goes with all that, whether ours or the SV's.  No system is perfect,
and these are still mainly 'Showline' dogs, ... but not as bad as Apple understands them. 

I was away from here for a while....and as such it appears I have missed something as I am not scamming anyone.

I work my dogs with several different professionals, and if I ever I do decided to breed him he will be professionally evaluated. He works in the real world everyday, and has yet to show me anything in the way of week nerves. If I get a great review on his working ability we will pursue the health tests, and because I may never know his pedigree I will do every test available.

Thanks for all of your opinions and advice. I think we got slightly side tracked, and maybe lost me at some point, but I do appreciate everyone that took the time to comment.