Need Opinion on Future Breeding - Page 3

Could have none, could have all...you'll never know unless you do it.   If only it were so easy to accurately guess what a breeding would produce down to the most minute details! 

Jenny, LOl, you evidently never had a real screamer, like Gustav is talking about. They will scream when you take them out of the crate on lead like they're being murdered ; at feeding time, scream like they are seeing their last meal; put them in a run, and they'll scream like their leg is hung in the fence if a lizard is sitting in the sun, quietly sunning itself. Oh, yeah, it's way more than just an annoyance. ;-) And you could multiply the screaming during all these mundane activities a gazillion times when on the field.

to me lines behind parents are important to see what type of dogs has come out of those lines, what things you see comming back in the most parts of that line, did the brothers or sisters to the grandparents have offspring? how were they if you compere them to the offspring of the grandparents? if the closed you go is 3-4 than i would compare my dogs to what is behind the 3-4 to see if i can fortify thos quallity's in my breeding or if my dogs go the other way i would never go back to those lines but go back to the lines on the other side (side my dog's resemble the most)
making the assumption that 2good dogs hopefully will give good puppy's doesn't make sence to me
at the end of the year i will use an ellute son (roger barnero) because he goes to his mothersline not for ellute

this discussion reminds me of a thread from a while back........when we we discussing breeding high prey to high prey----sport dogs.  at some point breeders are going to have to put prey drive on the back burner and reintroduce some good solid nerves and true working ability.  all prey drive for several generations is not sustainable.  yeah, i had a screamer a long time ago, too.  that's what it stemmed from----lack of good solid nerves, low threshold.  i don't care how many times we say it:  what's wrong with the breed today is lack of good nerve and lack of true working ability, but people don't listen so we might as well save our breath.  not everyone, but many many just keep breeding to whatever gets the titles and high points.  this is NOT a breeding program.  need more emphasis on dam lines and using studs that compliment the bitch rather than focusing so much on winning males :(
pjp

Yep!

luc vasteenbrugge(des deux pottois) and johan weckhuyzen(van de duvetorre) 2 of the best breeders ever in workingline dogs (malinois) have told me if you don't have a super female don't start a breeding program
once you checked the lines behind your female and compared her to other offspring her bloodlines only then you can start selecting a male out of same lines (line/inbreeding) if you are certain about healthissues or an outcross but than again check the lines behind him and what has come out of those lines/or more important what hasn't.
at the end of the year we make the combo
roger barnero X kimba vom blutsenhof

["check the lines behind him and what has come out of those lines/or more important what hasn't."]

excellent examples & excellent advice.  i would just add what gustav says:  don't look for the exceptional
dogs, look for for is typical in the bloodline because that is more likely what you are going to produce. 
reproducing the exception is very nearly impossible because it is not what that line typically produces.
pjp

***heh, we have a nice discussion rolling again.  :)  i have really missed that.

I guess that screamer stuff is alright for sport. I know a couple of my pups have gone for police work and a couple now are heading that way.
I was told that screamer trait is NOT desired for police dogs.

Never onces heard of a department saying hows that dog on making noises.

No, Joan, I haven't nor would I keep or breed one. I thought I was pretty clear that an occasional "I need to win" scream wasn't a dealbreaker, but a frequent or continual screamer was a big "No thank you!" If I remember right, I said "Yuck" which is pretty much how I feel about that inability to control themselves when agitated/stimulated/excited/whatever. 

Like I said, I've had occasional screamers and coincidentally or not, they did go back to the T litter vd BN, but they were very controllable, solid, no other issues, etc. so a scream now and again when super stimulated wouldn't be a deal breaker to me. Now, would I be extra careful who I bred a dog like that to? You bet. As we sow, so shall we reap. We've done this to ourselves, with these unbalanced dogs. Points dogs cannot be all we breed.