Mycoplasma/Stud Refund - Page 3

I think it's only reasonable for the stud owner to keep to the same standards they require of the female.  It's almost never done and the burden of proof is always on the owner of the female.  A test for mycoplasma isn't cheap, usually around $250.  Don't the females deserve the same level of protection as the males????

It's time for things to change and accountability become the norm, not the exception. 

Judy

  Agreed Judy..

Let us not forget we are ALL Ambassadors of this breed be the stud owner or the owner of the breeding female.  We all MUST stand by what is right for these animals, anything less is unethical.    I know there are probably some breeders that do test their studs, this post is not aimed toward them.  They know what trouble it can cause not to test, that is the smart thing to do. 

This caused my girls to be put on antibiotics for 45 days, I probably paid for two stud fees by the time I will be finished paying vet bills and related costs.  I also know there are probably worse scenarios than mine. The burden of proof should not always fall on the female.  The stud owner can just walk away with no obligation no concern nothing...SO WRONG!

i would like to ad that i imported a dog from germany, i had her into the vet the next week and had brucella ,vagina cultures and mycoplasma done , its the first thing i do when i get a new dog into my kennel any way she came back with a light case of mycoplasma and vagina  infection , we got her on  meds for 14 days and retested her and it was gone, so what i can tell you if they have a light case of mycoplasma it wont take much to get rid of but having alot may take awhile and some never get rid of it. females are alot cheaper than males to do the test. it is very hard to get rid of this on males, and my friends male  will have it the rest of his life and some times he may get a few pups and other times he gets nothing.  my female only produce 3 puppies in germany but after i got her clean she doubled her litters. i have a stud and would never breed him  to any female that was not tested , its not worth it and i really dont care if he never gets used with outside females.
now yes when you get the test back it will say how bad the mycoplama is and you must rest as  the dog may still have it. mycoplasma can produce small litters or no puppies at all/
i am guessing if this stud is not producing any puppies he has a pretty bad case. 

Is this only transmitted through live cover or is it carried in the sperm when doing an AI? Does direct contact have to occur?

the Mycoplasma is in the semien, so AI will not help, you will need to cure the dog of Mycoplasma not to  get it and i will also say that a dog can get mycoplasma almost anywhere not just from breeding. it can spread very fast in a kennel like Brucella.  it is a must for my breeding program.
and if a breeder wont do the test then look else where for a stud it not worth the risk.

Here in Oz we only pay a service fee at time of the mating maybe $250 balance due when the female has whelped her litter of more than 2 or 3 live puppies depending on the agreement.  If there are no puppies a return stud with no service fee if required if not then no more money.  You pay for the service of the dog so to speak.  There are instances of no money is paid at the time of the mating but say a fee of $100 per live puppy therefore small litter small stud fee, big litter big stud fee.  No-one pays full price up front.

That's all good and fine, we are not talking "contracts" or when the money is to be paid, we are talking about two "tested/clean" females prior to breeding that came up with these infections after breeding to a particular male.  

Many thanks for your post...

I have to agree with both sides of the arguement.  I do think if I was to breed my female, I wouldn't breed her unless the male showed proof of being clean so many days prior.  I think that is responsibility to keep my dog as free as possible.  but, on the other hand.  You do have vet records to show proof that both dogs were clean prior to mating.  since the contract did state two viable puppies, I can't see getting stud fees back.   However, I can see where the stud owner should at least pay the vet bills for the two females in questions.  i would demand a new vet report on the stud.  i love watching court shows on tv, and can see where that might be enough evidence where the stud had good chance of contaminating the females.   Judge brown sometimes asks vets to due tests on animals to try to get in bottom of some animal injury reports.   

there is a problem with getting a vet report on the stud in question , what if this breeder lie and said he did not have Mycoplasma and give you a recent vet report, well in that time she could of got him checked and put him on meds. so now he could come clean. breeders do anything to get out of paying any money. if this was to go to court you can get all the vet report require from breeder for court supina.  well i hope this breed either gives the money back or pays for your vet cost as others have said, the breeder should try to resolve this without going to court.. 

as a stud owner and an owner of breeding females - here is my take on this.

first, I also guarantee live  healthy puppies, I don't limit the repeat breedings to "one" - the female is pregnant for the stud fee paid, or a repeat breeding (and another and another) is given, to that female or another approved female - until there is a healthy litter. I guarantee at least one live healthy puppy per stud fee - because the # of puppies is dependant on the female, not the male - if he sired one puppy, he had plenty of semen to sire 12.  If she only had one viable egg that matured, that's a pregnancy and the stud fee was earned.

That said, if a female who was proven and tested such as yours was, missed the pregnancy - then the next step would have been to A) require the stud dog to be collected and tested for motility/percentage and viable sperm, or B) proof of current recent litter or current pregnant female sired by him.  If everything looked good with the stud dog's semen or if he indeed had sired a recent litter or there was a female confirmed pregnant by him - then I would have repeated the breeding with the same tests done for my female as you did.  Or sent another proven tested female for the repeat breeding, as you also did.

I think you made the mistake of skipping the step of having the male tested or making sure he was the sire of a recent litter or pregnant female. 

IF in fact the male is tested and comes up sterile or contaminated with  mycoplasma or other problem which can cause him to be infertile or infect the female - then you definately have cause to demand a refund or replacement stud dog for your females.  If he's tested healthy or has sired other litters in this time frame, then I believe you are not entitled to a refund and it might be just bad luck.

I tend to think that the stud dog, if tested, will come up sterile or infected.  As you say, there is no good reason why both proven/tested females would come up empty more than once, and then also come up positive for mycoplasma when they had previously been tested negative for it.  I'd pursue that and get your refund, or take the stud owner to court to get things settled in that case.  Especially if he is not willing to get his stud dog tested to see if he is healthy or not.

molly