The "out" in SchH - Page 3

hmmm . i found the original post interesting .. ' out and stare" .... : why does the poster think of that behavior as an out and stare .. i have taught both : out =>  bark /hold  and out => silent /sit or platz]  guard ... unlike my malinios , who as a breed are generally reactive and impulsive .. my GSDS by nature are more pensive/ contemplative/problem solvers , calm cool and collected .. the bark and hold 1. shows me to much about the dog .yes it can demonstrate the power / confidence , aggression etc about the dog .. but... sometimes i DO NOT WANT anyone to size up my dog...  to a trained eye the bark/hold  can reveal the true nature and the weaknesess  within  dog more than its stregnth   .this can be demontsrated  by seeing a frantic /hecticdisplay  or by listening to the uneasy dog talk i.e. the pitch/frequency of the bark ... 2. a  bark /hold not taught correctly can also create control problems . another preference that i personally like is to teach my dog self control .. to work calm cool and collected and to work in unison with me ... the scenario is not about the dog and the helper but about me and the dog in synergy together.   we work ... IN STEALTH !!! i think this be better taught to a dog , and it is not a stare .. but rather .. the dog has a task .. GUARD and AUTOMATIC ATTACK upon an inkling of helper movement . again not a stare but a dog composed , concentrating / thinking/ calculating it's opponent ... not an emotional mouthing off ,,, jumping  up and down nut case. no dirty biting.. a confidently  poised GSD not revealing it's capabilities or showing it's hand until it needs to act.  reminds me of a person coming in to my yard ..,. saw my persoanl proection dog going balliatic .. he said woo .. wehat a dog !! i smiled and chuckled ... the one laying down at my feet... i said ..." the one you are looking at , that you see acting out ...sounding off. huh that is not the one to worry about .. it's this female right here watching you , observing you , not a wrinkle and SILENT .. this is the one that would be right on you and do you in faster that than that other....then i gave him a demo with using her with my training friend.. his jaw dropped . he said .. holy ******   i would never have guessed... i replied .. yaaaaaa . she works calmly  with confidence and poise  in stealth !!

 What was this "test" originally intended for?

From my understanding an officer sent his dog searching for the "bad guy" & when the dog found him he barked to alert the officer where they were at & held him until the officer got there. Engaged if the suspect moved or tried to escape, then outed & continued to alert until officer got there. Once the officer was there they would escort the suspect to the station. Why change the original purpose? 

I seeconversations about show lines ruining the GSD, can't it be said that sport, sleeve orientated dogs are to? Sure the dog looks powerful barking 3 inches from the "bad guys" face but how hard is it to stab a dog that close or do something else? I want my dog 3-4 feet from you where she can still re-engage but safe holding distance, but i would probably loose points. I know there are serious dogs that excel in the "sport" but not as many as the ones  that would run from real pressure & they get better scores for the look. Kinda backwards, huh?

Why has schutzhund changed for the look & the sport? 
Sorry for going of topic. 

Remione1won, it is a sport. Just like hunting and fishing. They started out as a means to survive, but are pretty much a sport today. Max is Dead! I'm not saying the dog shouldn't serve a purpose, but it is up to the living to dictate that, and most of the living feel that prancing in a ring is the purpose. Ford had a vision. In it, I'm not sure if he thought about 5 lane highways with 5' broads driving Excursions at 80 MPH.

remione1.. you have a valid outlook .. there is a time and place for everything !!  a canine barking upon a find .. a criinal .. a lost person .. all has merit ..  there would be no left without a right .. no laugh without a cry ... each sport is unique and equally important  in discovering the GSD and ourselves and each exercise in a sport presented with a different twist but  yet succesfully accomplishing the task .. AP

From my understanding an officer sent his dog searching for the "bad guy" & when the dog found him he barked to alert the officer where they were at & held him until the officer got there. Engaged if the suspect moved or tried to escape, then outed & continued to alert until officer got there. Once the officer was there they would escort the suspect to the station. Why change the original purpose?

Your understanding is incorrect. The dog only has to bark in the blind. That is called a "bark and hold". The dog can either bark or be silent after the outs. This is called "guarding". No "original purpose" has been changed.

 Thanks Chris, I'll re-read & ask about it tonight at training. Not trying to knock anyone was just confused why they would change it. I might have been mistaken.
Are you the same Chris Smith from southern California?