What to do with - Page 3

Anyways, I'm getting way off topic, and the reason Robby has HD is not relavant.

So the prevailing opinion is that the x-ray positioning was good, and that re x-raying will most likely not improve his hip score.

Thanks you all for you time!  I do appreciate it.  If others have opinions please chime in.

 Interesting how different people read things and interpret. The main point I got out of that article is that unilateral HD is not genetic, but caused by 'weekend warrior" syndrome. Puppies loose and free to exercise themselves rarely have this, but puppies growing up in suburbia and crated while people are at work, school, and then trained on weekends often suffer unilateral HD due to injury from being out of shape. Left is more common than right (and how many reading this can think of a dog w/unilateral left HD?) due to dogs being "right handed." The left hip bears the brunt.

I would make sure Jean  has explicitly said she will not help before plastering her name all over the database if you want her to compensate you in any way. Internet forum etiquette, if you will. I would want to be given the opportunity to deal with the situation prior to having it all over the database, but that's just me.  

 Actually, I find the reason VERY relevant, but then, I breed, so I probably care more than the average person. The left side would look better if the knee was turned properly. Yes, some remodeling would still be apparent, but maybe enough that he could pass SV w/an A2 or A3, or even OFA fair. Hard to say. I've seen crazier things happen w/OFA.

This is why I find the system so lacking. So, there's a gene that makes left hips bad and right hips perfect and it happens only w/the left hip 90% of the time??? I think, as breeders and critical thinkers, we need to understand HD more thoroughly.  


I know you had said before that you would never breed him due to various reasons, but let's say those reasons weren't issues. Let's say this was the only issue; how disappointing to remove him from the gene pool for something that possibly is not genetic. <sigh>  

As to getting rid of him at this point, if he's dysplastic, he's dysplastic, and is probably more valuable to you than anyone else. If he's not valuable enough to you to keep, then you will probably be selling him for a low "rehoming" fee, I would guess. I sold a several thousand dollar PSD  (I say this because that's what I had him sold for before his hips were xrayed, lol) for $500. That's how it goes sometimes. If you really don't want him anymore, I wouldn't bother putting his SchH1 on him. It won't increase his value enough, IMO. I may be wrong...it's happened before, LOL!

Jen,

Unilateral HD is what I'm calling environmentally induced.  So we got the same thing out, I just didn't summarize very well.   I don't consider one person's unscientific opinion to be the truth until futher evidence is provided.  I believe this because of the scientific education I have recieved.

And I haven't said anything wrong or bad about Jean.  I didn't fullfil the contract, therefore Jean does not have to compensate me, nor do I expect her to.  She has been helpful in that she has given me suggestions on ways to get a passing hip score.


Renee,

The hip contract was void 1.5 years ago when I couldn't/didn't get Robby's hips prelimed at age 12mths without sedation.  My fault, not Jeans fault.

Michele

Jen,

You've brought up quite a few issues.

1)  Putting a SchH1 on Robby isn't about making him more valuable.  Its about be finishing something I've started.  And we are too close to just end here.  Its also about developing the skills necessary to teach him the things I haven't taught him yet. (ex. he retrieves dumbs well, but I haven't pieced it together with the jump).

2) I haven't research current findings on the development of the hips.  I do know that there are organs/parts of the body that initially develop bilateral and then during development start to develop unilateral (ex. the development of the vasculature of near the heart).  Some gene is directing the development of one side of the body over the other when it comes to the my example.  Someone at OFA believes the pervasiveness of left hip dysplasia is genetic.  Seems like a good assumption.  The theory that 90% of dogs are right legged, hmmm.

3)  I did say I wouldn't breed him personally for a variety of reasons.  I tend to have a high standard.  But I think he is a great dog that would produce sportier pups.  I was like you Jen in that I was overly critical of him until I started seeing other German Shepherds.

The contract I had with Vom Banach K9 required an OFA prelim at 12 months.  July even called to remind me.

I told her that I wasn't ever going to collect on the contract.  If his hips were bad, I would just live with it.  I certainly didn't want a replacement puppy.  I can only handle one puppy at a time.  The only guarantee that meant anything to me was that his parents were both from A stamped good German lines.  Both mother and father had low ZW scores.  I crossed my fingers.

When I submitted to OFA they came back with a Fair rating.  I called OFA and was told that better positioning (the positioning was OK) might get him a good as it was a split decision.  Two vets scored him as Fair and one vet scored him as Good.  So, that was good enough for me.  I am thankful that his hips are good enough.

Good luck,

Michele

 What you do with your dog is none of my business and I could not care less, except that I feel for all the dogs who get rehomed when they don't prove perfect. Your responsibility to him is to make sure he goes to a good home, and as long as you do that, I have no issue with it. 

You asked about "compensation" for training so I gave my opinion. You are not in the mood for opinions this evening, it seems. I understand you had a bad day at the mailbox. Truly, I do. If it makes you feel better to say that it's my lack of higher level education (LMAO) that renders me unable to understand why the article I posted has no bearing on your situation, so be it. 

As to comparing yourself and your standards to mine, keep in mind I researched approximately TEN YEARS before making a breeding decision. My hesitation on the dog of mine in question in the other thread was an inch of height...not anything temperamental, nor a blatant physical flaw. It's great to be overly critical...but make sure you've seen enough GSDs to judge accurately. 

Again, I really am sorry for your disappointment and I apologize if what I thought was helpful information offended you in any way. I'm done here. 

Jen,

You have not offended me.  But I am sorry that I have offended you.  I don't know your educational level and wasn't directing that statement to you personally.  Reading it now, it comes off as arrogant.  I appologize to others who are offended.  We were having a public discussion on the article and its validity.  I was silly in using an appeal to authority to refute an appeal to authority.  But the point is, one person's unscientific opinion cant be evidence for why my dog has unilateral hip dysplasia.

You said putting a SchH 1 would not increase his monetary value, therefore I shouldn't put one on him.  I wanted to clarify why I was getting his SchH1.  Its not about money/value.  It is important for me that people understand my motives.



Pharaoh,

I would never give back/rehome my 10 y/o border collie (aquired at age 8wks) or my 1 y/o kitty (aquired age 3 months).  I fell in love with them the moment I set eyes on them.  It has taken me long time to bond with Robby.  I don't know why.  Which is why I am contemplating a new home.


Can a dog with moderate hip dysplasia be worked/trained i Schuzthund?

yes a dog with moderate hd can be worked , trialed, competed, like stated on page 1, you just need to look at supplementing him, swimming him to reduce laxation, and know your dog. if he starts showing signs, then it may be time to retire him.

this coming from a guy that just did a 1 yr deployment with 2 hurneiated disks, came home and was asked how i did it? 3 weeks later had surgery, where they placed a titanium cage, 4 screws and a plate in my c6-c7, came out of surgery, got out of bed 45 min later, started walking around and was ready to go home.

dogs are really no different, some can and will work through much more than others, and never really show any signs of hd.

kenny

Jen,

Interesting that you feel bad for only the dogs that get rehomed because they don't prove perfect.  Dogs dont have self awareness.  They don't know why they have found themselves in a new environment with new people.  They don't know that they are faulty.  Titled dogs imported for breeding are going to have the same emotions as a HD dogs that are rehomed.  But all becomes well with the dog once he/she bonds with its new owner.