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by sueincc on 23 August 2010 - 16:08
Who said it was OK? I said they don't cheat and are not abusive. Again, those who are truly interested need to contact the trainers they are interested in, don't pay attention to internet gossip.
Here is an example: I have a dog who's drives will go through the roof if I stare in his eyes too intensly while heeling. So to Louise I am now cheating because if I feel his drives aren't where i want them, I can raise them by staring into his eyes a certain way. I don't call this cheating, it is reading and knowing my dog.
Here is another example: Louise you use an ecollar. Some people would say you are abusive to your dog simply because you use an ecollar. Obviously I don't think so, but some people don't understand how to use an ecollar correctly. Perhaps you need to leave room for the possibility that you didn't understand what you saw or misread the event you describe.
Here is an example: I have a dog who's drives will go through the roof if I stare in his eyes too intensly while heeling. So to Louise I am now cheating because if I feel his drives aren't where i want them, I can raise them by staring into his eyes a certain way. I don't call this cheating, it is reading and knowing my dog.
Here is another example: Louise you use an ecollar. Some people would say you are abusive to your dog simply because you use an ecollar. Obviously I don't think so, but some people don't understand how to use an ecollar correctly. Perhaps you need to leave room for the possibility that you didn't understand what you saw or misread the event you describe.
by judron55 on 23 August 2010 - 16:08
check them both out and decide for yourself.......you sure won't find out here!
by Louise M. Penery on 23 August 2010 - 17:08
Louise you use an ecollar.
Yes, I also use the e-collar on myself (usually on the sensitive area of my arm where blood is drawn) to check the level of stimulation.
I can also use calming body language such as yawning to keep my dog from breaking the long down.
Yes, I also use the e-collar on myself (usually on the sensitive area of my arm where blood is drawn) to check the level of stimulation.
I can also use calming body language such as yawning to keep my dog from breaking the long down.
by PowerHaus on 23 August 2010 - 17:08
Did you know yawning is a sign of nervousness in a dog?
LOL, I just realized that you contradicted your "cheating" point of view! So, YOU yawn to keep the dog from breaking the long down??????? Isn't this a "handler help", or a "breathing pattern" or CHEATING as you put it? Your a hipocrite! LOL
Vickie
www.PowerHausKennels.com
LOL, I just realized that you contradicted your "cheating" point of view! So, YOU yawn to keep the dog from breaking the long down??????? Isn't this a "handler help", or a "breathing pattern" or CHEATING as you put it? Your a hipocrite! LOL
Vickie
www.PowerHausKennels.com
by PowerHaus on 23 August 2010 - 17:08
Louise.....you are not the caliber of person who belongs at a Dean Seminar! Why don't you just keep to your AKC trials?
I have trained pleanty with Dean and have NEVER seen him abuse a dog, EVER! He and Mark both are, again, PHENOMINAL trainers and Dean is a wonderful teacher but you have to decide if YOU are tough enough to handle the pressure that he puts on the handler in the name of fairness to the dog! Most people are not! He equally applies the required and appropriate amount of pressure to the dogs to bring the best out of the dog! As I was once told......."Most people are content with a Ford, I want a Mazeratti." Mark and Dean with their respective dogs/partners haven't won Major Championships with wimpy training or wimpy dogs!
I have had a dog that was handler agressive and Dean and Rolland "fixed" this dog for me with the 2 pinch collar method that you may have seen! This dog had NO respect for me and he needed to be taught a lesson of "respect for the handler" for my safety and his as well! He got the message loud and clear and learned quick! I suppose you have never trained a dog like this. He was a very good dog and is the same dog as is in my avatar.
Vickie
www.PowerHausKennels.com
I have trained pleanty with Dean and have NEVER seen him abuse a dog, EVER! He and Mark both are, again, PHENOMINAL trainers and Dean is a wonderful teacher but you have to decide if YOU are tough enough to handle the pressure that he puts on the handler in the name of fairness to the dog! Most people are not! He equally applies the required and appropriate amount of pressure to the dogs to bring the best out of the dog! As I was once told......."Most people are content with a Ford, I want a Mazeratti." Mark and Dean with their respective dogs/partners haven't won Major Championships with wimpy training or wimpy dogs!
I have had a dog that was handler agressive and Dean and Rolland "fixed" this dog for me with the 2 pinch collar method that you may have seen! This dog had NO respect for me and he needed to be taught a lesson of "respect for the handler" for my safety and his as well! He got the message loud and clear and learned quick! I suppose you have never trained a dog like this. He was a very good dog and is the same dog as is in my avatar.
Vickie
www.PowerHausKennels.com
by Mystere on 23 August 2010 - 18:08
I hesitate to get into this at all, but...
1. I have attended several seminars with Dean and I have never seen any abusive behavior, even when one seminar was hosted by a club run by a very abusive trainer and attended by several abusive trainers. I have heard lots of stories of Dean kicking dogs at seminar, but never seen it while attending at least 5 or 6 Calderon seminars.
2. Yes, Dean has sold equipment. I believe it was Schweigert. He even had a booth at the 2002 North American in Washington State. I purchased items from him at the time.
So, what's the big deal? Lots of competitors also sell training equipment. Who would be more knowledgeable about dog- training equipment--a soccer-Mom?
3. Yes, the cues, whether breathing, hands, neck-rolls, food in the mouth during OB, etc. are all handler-help. One German judge told me that they are "only handler-helps, if the judge catches it." He used a lot of these "handler-helps" himself and I could virtually spot people who trained with him from the handler-help they used on the field. If not actually cheating, it certainly counts as "fudging" a bit and everyone has some of them, because many are totally unconscious by the handler. Each and every one will lose you points, if the judge sees it, conscious or otherwise.
1. I have attended several seminars with Dean and I have never seen any abusive behavior, even when one seminar was hosted by a club run by a very abusive trainer and attended by several abusive trainers. I have heard lots of stories of Dean kicking dogs at seminar, but never seen it while attending at least 5 or 6 Calderon seminars.
2. Yes, Dean has sold equipment. I believe it was Schweigert. He even had a booth at the 2002 North American in Washington State. I purchased items from him at the time.
So, what's the big deal? Lots of competitors also sell training equipment. Who would be more knowledgeable about dog- training equipment--a soccer-Mom? 3. Yes, the cues, whether breathing, hands, neck-rolls, food in the mouth during OB, etc. are all handler-help. One German judge told me that they are "only handler-helps, if the judge catches it." He used a lot of these "handler-helps" himself and I could virtually spot people who trained with him from the handler-help they used on the field. If not actually cheating, it certainly counts as "fudging" a bit and everyone has some of them, because many are totally unconscious by the handler. Each and every one will lose you points, if the judge sees it, conscious or otherwise.
by PowerHaus on 23 August 2010 - 18:08
by malndobe on 23 August 2010 - 19:08
Hmmm, Mark or Dean. I know Mark a lot better, since we trained together before he ever got into Schutzhund. Dean I only know from a number of seminars. Dean has an experience level Mark hasn't achieved, yet. So if I was looking for problem solving, I'd probably lean towards Dean since he's been in the game a lot longer, and has had his hands on a lot more dogs, therefore he should have a wider range of ideas for solving issues. But if I was looking for someone to train with on a regular basis it would have to be Mark, IMO he's more open to other sports and breeds.
It's like asking "which is better, apples or oranges". Well it really depends. Some people love one and hate the other, but for most it's more a question of are you in the mood for crisp, crunchy, sweet, tangy, ?? And if you do decide on an apple, do you want a red one, green one, granny smith, ??
It's like asking "which is better, apples or oranges". Well it really depends. Some people love one and hate the other, but for most it's more a question of are you in the mood for crisp, crunchy, sweet, tangy, ?? And if you do decide on an apple, do you want a red one, green one, granny smith, ??
by ShelleyR on 23 August 2010 - 20:08
Do you have anything nice to say about ANYBODY Louise? I never saw Dean deliver an unfair correction in 100's of training sessions. Strong, yes, effective, yes, unfair, no.
WHAT Feather River Schutzhund Club seminar are you referring to? I distinctly recall having founded that club. I presonally hosted training sessions 2-3 times a week, WITH Dean, and trials, club to regional level, several a year, for oh... 7 years. (1990-1997) Yet, I don't recall what you are talking about. I'm guessing your memory is failing, confusing Dean with Leon or Thomas... who took over the club after I left. (HUGE insult to Dean BTW) It would be difficult for me to believe either of those two would invite Dean to do a seminar, but...
Oh heck. It doesn't matter. You've never been the caliber of handler who could benefit from training with anyone good.
WHAT Feather River Schutzhund Club seminar are you referring to? I distinctly recall having founded that club. I presonally hosted training sessions 2-3 times a week, WITH Dean, and trials, club to regional level, several a year, for oh... 7 years. (1990-1997) Yet, I don't recall what you are talking about. I'm guessing your memory is failing, confusing Dean with Leon or Thomas... who took over the club after I left. (HUGE insult to Dean BTW) It would be difficult for me to believe either of those two would invite Dean to do a seminar, but...
Oh heck. It doesn't matter. You've never been the caliber of handler who could benefit from training with anyone good.
by skidoo on 23 August 2010 - 21:08
But gosh, what a negative posting.
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