Weak K9 almost gets handler killed - Page 3

And, I might add, that whereas schutzhund teaches behaviors which are then put together into a trial performance (and uses a combination of prey, food, and other drives not related to social dominance and fighting drives), a good police dog should have confidence and fighting drive (i.e. "man drive" or "civil drive").
It's like a lot of things.. very often, you can get by with less. A heavy screwdriver can do the work of several tools, but not well. But there could come the day when you're in a really serious situation, and you need all the dog you can get. If you're smart and / or lucky, you get the dog you will maybe need, and then you are hoping you'll never really need him.
Please do not make the mistake to think that most GSDs are equal, or that they can be trained to do these very specialized things well. If this were so, there would be NO point in breeding and selecting. Unfortunately, now that people have learned to train for Schutzhund using only prey, food, and (to a degree) force, dogs are passing trials and getting Kkl1 with very little real hardness and defense / fighting or strong social drive.
Since we started to obsess on points so much, this makes things even worse for the real working dog, because it is very difficult (relatively speaking) to control a really aggressive dog than a dog in prey drive. REAL dogs tend not to score so high, especially in obedience.
I actually LIKE wussy dogs, too! But, I know them for what they are, and I don't make expectations of them which they cannot meet. I like all kinds of dogs.. They all have a purpose and their own jobs to do.

Hmmmm... An old memory just flashed back on me.. A nasty divorce that turned really ugly with the death of the wife, by gunshot. Her husband succeeded in finding her and caught her in a parking lot with her trained schutzhund 3 bitch. The dog stood by on leash while the hubby emptied a shotgun round into her midsection. Protection, NOT!!!! If your dog is not sharp and hard, you have a nice toy, and a great deterent, but you do not have protection. Not saying that we want dirty, nasty dogs, but there has to be a reasonable balance point, where the dog is effective but manageable. Dogs are not mass produced products. Each is different, and this was supposed to be the whole point of a trial, to probe and prove the dogs' nature.. NOT a  rubber stamp at the end of a mass production assembly line.

I agree Jim,
If you've never been there, done that, you have no idea.
Both man and dog did their part, and yes it could have been much worst.
I'm glad to be just a citizen, I have a few rules to follow but not anywhere near what an officer has to follow in the course of doing his duty correctly.
I have had times when a situation came up, I didn't hesitate going for my gun.  I don't even mind firing a round or two to make my position clear.  A cop is not allowed to do that.
I don't care to go hand to hand with anyone if I can end the situation at a modest distance.
And I don't care how hard your dog is, I've known hard dogs to get killed just as quick as well trained officers.
Rock, paper, Scissors, Man, Dog, Gun.

Moons.

Hey, Two Moons!

  I'm killing time inside today. It's too hot outside and I'm putting off going out (and only making it worse for myself).

  I'm really not a pugnacious person, but I understand the dynamics. There are some crazy people out there and they don't mind to hurt you. I don't even own a gun.. Only had a .22 air rife at one point, and fired it a few times, got bored, gave it away. I don't feel a need for a gun, but I will defend your right to have one!

  One night I was pulling up to my house and a really crazy looking guy (long hair) tried to come around the front of my truck and make it to me. The way he did it, I knew he was up to no good. He got directly in front of the truck, close and was coming fast. I had not turned off the engine, yet, and I gunned the accelerator with my foot on the brake and made that truck jump. So did the guy. I unleashed a string of expletives at him and made it very clear that I would run his ass down without thinking twice if he tried to approach me. Then I got out of there and called the police.

  If I'd have had to go for a gun, I would not have gotten it in time. And, that's what I like about a dog. A good dog can react very quickly, and will, if you've trained him right. At least, he will be prepared and waiting for the word, even hoping. Polite and politically correct dogs won't react in time to help you much. Sometimes it is a lack of experience and training that can solve the problem. I had a VERY good bitch who ran a bad guy with a knife out of our house, but it took her a few moments to recognize the threat. She was only used to seeing friends in our house and she was momentarily confused. But, she "got it" and defused the situation. You really have to train your dog to be aware and ready in all situations. Clearly, the bitch in the video was inexperienced and not ready for that encounter, but all in all, she didn't do bad, did she? If she were mine, I'd be proud of her. I just don't think she was the dog to put into that situation. If it was all the officer could get, then I guess he decided to use her, probably hoping the intimidation factor would help.

Good point moons

I agree with jim as well

I used to work in an extremely bad nieghborhood.

One we had a robber pull a knife  on one of our cahiers, she hit him with a scalding cup of coffe, robber then hit 1 employee with a shopping cart.I then hit robber with an igloo cooler and customer and myself restrained the guy til police arrirved.

1) none of us including robber were using our weapon of choice,,, at times you just gotta play out the hand your dealt.and that can mean doing something that you are not sure if it will work.

2)the problem with the 3 of us is that we had no training, we all looked pretty stuipid but we got lucky.  proper training can help but at times luck has a great deal to do with things.  proper training can reduce the effect of luck but not entirely reduce it

3)  Was very happy to see police arrive and i would never want their job.

I do schutzhund  it is a good test  for the dogs but if you want a dog for protection you need to have some proper training for what you want to accomplish

JMO  Jeff

Lol, misbeeb.  Could you tell my wife that?

Jim

No doubt there is nothing like a good dog, this dog probably did give the officer time to react and saved his life.
A patrol dog with different training would have done more, if this and if that.
You never really know what any situation might turn into and my only point I guess is I think the dog did not almost get the handler killed.  I think the fact is anything can happen.
I would not want the job either.
Guns,
The real thrill of a weapon is hitting your target.  Having the ability to actually hit what you aim at is like hitting that home run over the fence.  The better you are at it the better it feels.   There is some excitement to the report of a large weapon and the destruction of a specific object too tho.  I love instinct shooting at long distances.  Its against the law but I love shooting at objects in water from great distances.  And rapid firing at close range with a hand gun.  I dunno...anything that goes boom!
I didn't start out because I felt the need, I started out as a young boy to hunt.
Finally there is the feeling of power, anyone who says they don't feel it is lieing.   It is a feeling of safety in a way too I guess.
The part most do not know or understand is the responsibility and the effect after the fact, and all the things that can go wrong.  Safety first, then common sense, then good manners and respect. 
Anything can become a weapon, and its only a tool, sometimes a toy.  Man has all the responsibility as to how they are used.
Some people don't care, they would charge a freight train, they have no respect for your life and whats worst they're own.
Thats when your in a spot.   Thats when anything can happen, and no matter how it turns out there is a price to pay.
You hope you can afford it.

I'm also having a slow day, damned Mondays.

I didn't read all the posts fully.  Too lazy.  But why is the dog the issue?  It is a single purpose k9 for drugs.  If this was a lab or a beagle, everyone would applaud the dog for doing what it could.
Why isn't the officer the focus of the discussion.  Maybe he should get to the gym and take a couple new self-defense courses offered by his department.  I know he was taught never to relinquish his weapon at the acadamy.    I think his training is more of an issue than the dogs.  Just my .02.