White Shepherd? - Page 3

Rockymud, I don't think whites get picked on more than any other disqualifying fault. If it doesn't fit the standard, it doesn't belong in the gene pool, in my opinion. It's a positive thing to see whites have their own breed recognition outside of the standard GSD. In fact, I'd prefer a white, I've seen 2 or 3 ok whites, I have yet to see a blue, blue/tan or liver/tan that isn't total crap physically and mentally.

Pam - I'm sorry, I dont think I am completley understanding what you are saying.

Just to clarify I am talking about the GSD, not the Alt Deusch.  The statement was incorrect because white GSDs were permissible, just not prefered by Stephanitz....not just certain strains.  Prior to the Early 30's there were no color disqualifactions in the SV standard that I can find...the 1924 edition of Stephanitz's book surely doesnt indicate disqualifications...though it does indicate preferences.  However, there were in fact SV registered white German Shepherds with the SV in the early years.

~Cate

Kczaja-
I have also seen some good whites. I like blue/tan on other breeds but not on the shepherd. Preferablly a Chihuahua. Maybe it is just because I have not seen a lot of blue/tan, livers, pandas.....etc. I do not mind the whites at all. I actually think they are beautiful. I just have never understood how a certain color is not in the standard. I sometimes think, if the color can be produced by great working/show parents, maybe there should be that color. Hopefully that made some sense.

Rocky

I believe the coat was originally disqualified because it was believed to be 'degenerative' ie causative of deafness, blindness, skin conditions, health conditions, albinism, etc.  Many also believed that the white caused the intensity of the red to diminish (incorrect) and that it caused white spots (also incorrect).  Other arguments I have heard is that white is linked to weak bone, white is linked to temperment problems, white is linked to weak nerves, etc...  My most recent favorite is that white is linked to increased sunburn...which cant be the case as the skin of the white shepherd dog and colored shepherd dog is the same...the allele only affects the fur.

I have also heard that whites cannot guard at night (certainly the case with buildings, but certainly not with sheep, and they are invisible in snowy conditions), cannot herd sheep because cannot be distinguished from sheep / sheep dont resepct white (not true...the sheep hate my Ruby and her coat is quite a bit whiter then the sheep are).

SO -- lol, there were lots of reasons...most of them wrong....but many of the assumptions were made at a time when genetic science was a little...um...rough.

But honestly, tis what it is.  I think it has led to better things in the long run.  One of the things that drew me to the whites at first wasnt the color of the coat but was the moderate to light rear angulation and the straight topline.

~Cate

Gotta share one of the best comments about Whites as being less desired...

Connecticut State Police K9 Officer came to the local All breed club and did a demonstration with their dog then opened it up to questions.... one GSD breeder (knowing I had whites) says to the Officer.... "But you'd NEVER use a White Shepherd as a police dog would you, cause they'd be seen too easily."   the cop turned around with a smile and says... "Ma'am.... by the time you see them... it's tooooooooooooo late!"   LOL

(By the way one of Wizard's Sons was a certified and working Police and narcotics dog)

What was the dog's name?  What department did he work for? (Wizard's pup, that is.)

Did the Connecticut State Police K9 Officer have a white GSD?

Windwalker-
I think each dog has the abiltiy to do anything the owner wants them to do. Good dogs are not all the same colors. =) I would also like to know the name.

Very interesting.
Rocky

I think a white GSD, yes it's a GSD is beautiful and stunning.  I also believe a white can be healthy and stable and have all the same trait's as any other GSD. 

Misinformation, predjudice, and myth abound.

I also like and own a solid black as I'm sure you know.  Also a striking animal and with every qualification.

Color is only important to the individual, it has nothing to do with performance and ability.  Or let's say performance and abilty have nothing to do with color.  There are exception's to every rule tho.    Not to get into a discussion over liver's, blue's, or emerging hybrid's, panda's etc.   Has anyone ever seen a true albino German Shepherd?  I would be curious to know.

It's interesting reading some of this history and some of the false myth's.

Brent.

From what I have read and garnered Shepherds dont even carry for the Albino gene.  The only white causing alleles that they carry for are the allele at the Extension Locus that cause the masking white of white shepherds, and those alleles at the Irish Spotting Locus that cause white spotting.

There are dogs with Snow Nose, but that isnt albino -- and the skin surrounding the nose is still pigmented.

~Cate

Two Moons- no misinformation on my part. I'll wager I've trained more whites than you'll meet in your life. I count on one hand the amount of them I thought were decent dogs mentally, and only 1 that I thought had a true working GSD temperament. I've trained a lot crappy sables and back and tans, too. But the precentage difference in quality is astounding. Perhaps that is becaiuse the so -called "GSD breeders" who deliberately breed these colors care little about the standard at all. The only serious white breeders I've met have been those who strive for separate recognition, and I respect them for it. Their dog tend to be a hell of a lot better, too.