not for beginners... - Page 3

IMO of "handler aggression" I interpret it as if a handler gives the dog an unfair correction this particular dog will not be so forgiving and may turn around to try them with a growl, or snap.  I don't interpret it as a "killer" who is unsafe.  This particular dog IMO when I see advertised would make me as a potential buyer assume would be more suitable for patrol work or a serious PP dog.  Certainly not a dog I'd expect to do schutzhund with.

A "one owner dog" to me would mean what a few others stated- will bond more with one person in the home and blow the other's off.  I have a bitch that I'd say is a little towards that as she bonds with the one who is working her and gives less regard to the other's.

Not for beginners - a dog who if not handled correctly might  come up the leash, a dog who if he does come back up, needs to be dealt with by an experienced handler who knows how to "nip that $hit in the bud",  a dog who needs an experienced handler who won't be too scared to correct  at all, or overreact  with inapproriate corrections.  Not for beginners is a dog for someone who knows how to read dogs and is experienced in handling & training.  Not for beginners, maybe the breeder wants the pup/dog to go to someone they are sure is going to do something with the dog.     

Sue I think you said it all in a nutt shell. lol  Good job!

Just about every new handler goes through a bad handler stage.  There is so much for a new handler to learn when entering the sport and on top of that they are trying to train a dog at the same time.  There is alot of confusion, handler being given directions (or yelled at) by the training director, trying to teach and correct their dog at the same time.  New handlers are not good with timing of rewards or corrections, they might be awkward at delivering the reward (tug, ball), many time's they get confused and flustered.  I've seen new handler's reward a dog for a behavior one minute and correct them for the same behavior the next.  I've seen new handlers use so many corrections during the teaching phase of a new excersise that the dog doesn't know what's up and what's down.  This is alot for some dogs to deal with.

A not for beginners dog might also be just very high drive, not necessarily handler aggressive at all.  Some dogs are so quick and powerful they might take your finger with the ball if you're not fast enough...is this handler aggression???...NO.  I've seen many people struggle with reward delivery that might not do well with a quick ball crazy dog.

I also want to mention, IMO there is a big difference between a dog that will snap or growl for an unfair correction and a dog that is handler aggressive (a dog that will turn and GO AFTER their handler with malicious intent).  I've seen some rather significant corrections by some experienced handlers that if done by a newbie that does not know their dog could get them into alot of trouble.  ie hard flanking, grabbing by the scruff and dragging around, hard relentless prong corrections that lift their front feet off the ground.

There is a certain clamness, confidence and charizma that an experienced handler has, dogs can read this and a dog that might be labeled as handler aggressive with a newbie, might excel and never put his mouth on an experienced handler.

JMO

Sorry I meant to say...

"I also want to mention, IMO there is a big difference between a dog that is handler hard (will snap or growl for an unfair correction) and a dog that is handler aggressive (a dog that will turn and GO AFTER their handler with malicious intent)." 

Some dogs are so quick and powerful they might take your finger with the ball if you're not fast enough...

lol...you just described my dog...my hands and knuckles have been busted with his teeth MANY times...

LOL my bitch is the same, I know exactly what you mean. 

Sue

I think you and I are on the same page. 

Melanie

Don't confuse handler hard with handler aggressive.  They are two different things. Handler hard, you stated, will snap and growl if unfairly corrected and that is wrong.  That is handler aggression.  Handler hard takes a correction well and bounces back immediately. I can put much more pressure on a handler hard dog that a soft, or even handler aggressive dog.

Come on now Chris.

All these breeders can claim their puppies are future world champions or top producers and you can't?

Must be your integrity talking

Yes Don you are right...that does make sense, although I have heard the term used incorrectly then. 

Thanks for clarifying.