Hernias in pups - Page 2

we adopted a gsd from a shelter and when we had her fixed they needed to also fix an umbilical hernia. no big deal. it did cost a bit extra, but again, it was no biggie, for us or her. we had no idea why she had it, and since we weren't "breeders" or anything, it didn't occur to us to ask if it was hereditary.

I had a case of hernia in a pup born by C-section, suggetsting genetic rather than a rough mother. I have a female who had a hernia as a pup, it was operated, no problems. In her first litter one pup had a hernia, in the second none did. These hernias do seem to be common, and mostly harmless, the op, if necessary is uncomplicated and inexpensive. Personally I do not think a small hernia is anything to worry about in a pup.

I feel that, hereditary or not hereditary, an umbilical hernia is a pre-existing condition on the sale of the puppy. If the breeder does not give you a discount upon the sale of the puppy for the hernia, then the breeder's other option should be to stand ready to give you a discount later, if it does not correct itself before the age of about six months (I had one that lasted somewhere around that long before it closed up on it's own). If the puppy is to be a pet, then the hernia can be closed when the pup is neutered or spayed. If not a pet, then there should be a significant discount to help cover the cost of the operation to close it on an intended breeding dog. Vets sometimes scare the dickens out of naive puppy buyers, who then do not give the hernia enough time to close, and want an immediate operation on an eight week old puppy. I just want to throttle vets who do that. I hear that throttling vets is illegal in all 50 states, however....sigh.

Why should a breeder give a discount? If you want a discount buy from the PennySaver. If you do not want to take the chance on a pup having its hernia close then dont buy it. Plain and simple. If a hernia is a big enough deal you would not pay full price, then why is he all of the sudden worth a discount. It is the same dog. When it is a small umbellical(sp) hernia, who cares it is nothing. Many times they will close up. I have had 3 GSD's in the last 3 years, Two had hernias. They both closed up by the time they were 5 months of age. Had I not told anyone you would never know. Should these dogs not be bred now? You can just push the fat on the belly right back through the tear. As the dog gets older this tear will begin to close back over the hernia. I am not a breeder or a Koermeister but I have never seen a dog not get a KKL rating due to a hernia...I may be wrong it may happen. Anybody have any info on whether it is a fault as far as a KKL is concerned?? D.H. you are extremely knowledgeable, any thoughts? Shawn

Pups with umbilical hernias are sold as pets at normal price with the written understanding that at the time of spay or nueter we will reimburse up to a specific amount to offset the hernia repair. This is considered a pre-existing condition and the right thing is to disclose the condition and stand behind what you have bred. JMHO Melody

Personally, I never had this issue as I would carefully hand the puppy to the dam for her to snip the cord with her teeth, and then remove the remainder with surgical scissors. But I know that some dams can be agressive "lickers" with their puppies, and further irritate the wound caused by removal of the cord. Scar tissue will of course develop as the wound is irritated by this constant aggravation. Somehow related to genetic causes? I think that may be a possibility, or perhaps it is a development-related issue? Who really knows? Not me, as I never had this issue. If it is sometimes of genetic cause, is it a disqualifier for breeding? I can't answer that either. Knocking on wood, Bob-O

If you think it is going to close, then offer to stand behind it just in case it doesn't. If it is bigger than normal and you think it might not close, offer a discount on a pup with an obvious defect in the litter. It was there before they bought it, making it a pre-existing condition. How many brand new cars with dented bumpers have you bought at full price lately? Veronica

I agree with most of the above, but have never felt the need to give a discount with the pup - and never been asked to. I disclose at the time of sale that the puppy has a small hernia, and get the new owner to see and feel the hernia, then I say as I wrote above, and ask them to come back to me if it gets troublesome and I would foot the cost of an op. NEVER had one get troublesome, and never had anyone say they had an op. My old lad of 11 has one and it never closed, never caused him a problem, and so I do tend to think its not a great deal to worry about. They make good pets, they make good working dogs, they make good show animals, they are well constructed - cant see why a discount would be appropriate for something that may NEVER affect their lives - providing, as the breeder of course, you are around for the opwners if a problem occurs, and will deal with it for them by way of cost. Also that you do disclose that the pup has a hernia at the time of sale. As Veronica states. some vets will make a big deal of this, and if you havent informed your new owner beforehand it must be very scary to be told its a problem. If you have a well informed new owner, then the situation does not occur. Mo Lakin - Mascani

I have read both that it is hereditary and that it is caused by the dam, don't think that anyone is 100% sure. Maybe the tendency for the dam to be too enthusiastic with biting the cord is inherited? I have also been told that it is not even considered a "fault". Do any of you conformation people have the lowdown on that? Vet also told me that it could cause problems with pregnancy and I wonder if anyone has experienced that?

I do not see a reason to give a discount. For something so minor in the breed?? There are bigger things to worry about, elbow dysplasia, hip dysplasia, pannus, etc. A small outie that affects nothing? Sorry. I do tell buyers if I have a pup that ends up with an outie, so they know. They also know they can either fix it or leave it be. There are just too many other "bigger" issues to deal with in this breed that I don't consider an outie cause for concern and def. wouldn't discount one from my breeding program like I would a dog with bad hips. As for problems with pregnancy? Only if the hernia is like the size of a 1/2 dollar or bigger could it be an issue. Then you might as well schedule a csection and fix it then. I had a friend that ended up having to do that on one that was fairly large like that. My previous comments refer to dime/nickel size ones. Just my perspective. Angela