Vaccine Debate - Page 2

back up what?  you don't think injection site sarcomas are documented?  you don't think it's known?  You don't think other cancers linked to vaccines aren't known in animal studies?  I also know that DPT  and MMR shot cause iselt activating compounds to be formed in humans that persist for up to 7 years.  these compounds are only found in vaccinated and those born with congenital rubella with levels returning to normal in about a year in the congenital group.   i'm certainly not going back to school and libraries and to a lab to re learn these things and give them to you.  I don't really care what you believe.

i also know that most of the diseases that "killed" infants and the young were a primary disease, but it was a secondary infection that kills the most.  IO also know that our advances in treating the secondary infections has done far more to alter the mortality rates than vaccination in human populations
i also know that vaccines can alter DNA.  I also know that vaccines contain things that are know to cause problems all on their own in a whole host of ways.  i'm certain it's "caused" a case of autism or two in humans as well and could be linked with hundreds of other diseases too.   Just like i'm sure there are a thousand other "causes" of autism and cancer and diabetes and everything else.

I know enough to make the decision I think are important for me and the health of my family, animals included. 

"Does anyone know if there is a discussion on accepting positive titer results for rabies for SV trials (instead of proof of vaccination)?"

Do you mean SV trials in Germany?

Because in the USA you have to go by the laws of your state, they set the rabies vax rules, not the veterinarians.  Because of the seriousness of rabies states are not accepting titers in lieu of rabies vaccination, you'd still legally be required to have vaccinations.  Also, the cost to do a rabies titer can be considerably more expensive than titers for other things.

Last time I checked, there are only two accepted labs for doing rabies titers in the U.S. and those titers may be used only for proof of rabies protection in dogs being transported outside the continental U.S. There are several problems with the idea of titers, including that titers are not actually a great method of assessing immunity.  A "positive" reading from the test is not the same as "immunity" and the correlation between titer and protection does not exist.  Further, there is no standardized lab method to determine titers in the few diseases for which titers can be run (in canines  - canine distemper, canine parvovirus, rabies {from the two labs}). Results and how to interpret them vary. Rabies vaccination requirements are set by the state as Tess notes, not veterinarians. Rabies, though not as endemic in our country as in some, remains a serious problem in many states. This past year, for example, we have seen multiple cases of rabies in my state. In some countries, one is foolish to consider interacting with a dog running at large. In the US, there was recently a case of a dog in a shelter where more than 30 people had to be tracked down and given rabies vaccination prophylaxis because they had all had contact with two dogs, one of whom was demonstrated to be rabid, and another suspected but destroyed and discarded before testing. The dogs in the shelter also were put down where there was any doubt as to their rabies vx status. I posted that recently.

Actually I think the documentary I linked is less than a year old, it aired 4, 27 2010. 

Sueincc,

You are correct. I remember seeing it and I posted here about it being on last April.  But for some reason I had it in my head that it was a bit older. Time flies in my head.....

Thanks - I'm in Canada here and rabies is not mandatory where I live, however my dogs are always vaccinated against rabies. I have been on trial with dogs only in Germany, where you used to hand in your vacc. certificate at the club. I don't know if it still is like that.
I know that no vaccination provides 100% protection, so in this regards, titers can provide me with information that I need. Here titers are cheapers than the actual vaccination.

 It's very simple--vaccinations save the lives of humans and animals.  There is a risk with anything in life.  Your chances of being killed in a car, bus, train, or airplane are much higher than than dying as a result of a vaccination.  So, knowing the risks, are you going to avoid being in a car, bus, train, or airplane?  After all, why risk it?  Ridiculous!  Don't forget small pox killed millions of people world wide and still would be if we did not eradicate it with vaccinations.  Thank you Edward Jenner!  

 ggturner, your views are a bit misguided, IMHO. You are assuming that the vaccines are both effective and necessary, and neither of which has been proven to my satisfaction regarding many vaccines. In fact, there is really no medical evidence showing yearly vaccination- or really, any boosters after puppy shots- are needed. Do some research and see who sets the protocols (I'll give you a hint- they stand to lose a lot of money if we question boosters). I think you're a bit naive.  Vaccines are not created equal. Some work beautifully w/few side effects. Some hardly work at all and have devastating side effects. To make a blanket statement that "vaccines save the lives of humans and animals" is naive and undereducated. 

 LOL......hopeless..........

Jenni, IMHO, vaccines do save lives. And you are right, some vaccines like Lyme for dogs, does not have a good track record. But I still want whatever protection is available. It also doesn't mean all vaccines don't work. I think we need more laws, for people like you!  And honest research too. This fraud, or all fraud, takes away so much more than just our money.  I wish I were naive and uneducated, I wouldn't notice so much disturbing stuff.