E-Collar harmful?? - Page 2

I hope your friend will either find a good trainer to work with her or else place the dog in a more appropriate living situation. From what little you've described she's trying to fry the dog into obedience and no good comes from that. The e-collar can be a good tool but this does NOT sound like the "right answer".

 Hey Tess, cool story!

Thanks!  He's a cool dog, and I'd tried everything, including an e-collar.  I admit the e-collar, at the highest setting, could eventually get his attention and eventually break his concentration, but it did nothing to lessen his true anxiety (which is what it is) and reaction to other dogs. 

I'd seen too many "obedience class" click-click-click, heel-heel-heel with the foofie dogs and HATED it, but thought well, I don't have to be that stupid about it.  So I read Karen Pryor's book and also a book called Click to Calm, and they helped.  I admit, in my desperation, I even watched that Victoria Stillwell lady, who uses clickers to treat aggression.  I actually think her methods would work: once the dog is marking to the clicker, she works by ascertaining the dog's tolerable distance.  IOW, it may be that at first you have to work with another person with a dog far away across a big field, and eventually you get closer and closer.  I think that WITH TRAINING, this method would work for many dogs.  I'm sure too many people don't have the patience to do it gradually; tv makes it look like it's all done in 10 minutes.

TessJ10 - I forgot to mention in my post the point you brought out about using e-collars for dog aggression. I had that problem with one dog before I had full knowledge of it's use for the purpose. In fact, I initially went by the literature of one highly experienced breeder/trainer who stated that the only time an e-collar is to be used at maximum output is to train out dog aggression - fortunately I was able to quickly notice it had disastrous results leading to a higher level of aggression!

I too am a great enthusiast of clicker training and, though I have not specifically tried it for aggression (did not need to as the dogs I trained with the clicker did not have an aggression problem, possibly because use of the clicker gave me their full attention) I have had almost magical results with the clicker with some traditionally "stubborn" or independent natured breeds like Cairn Terriers which, in my experience, take far more effort to train with the 'traditional' methods. I use the clicker routinely now to shape behavior and build confidence of  very young GSD pups (7 weeks onwards) and to familiarize them with the meanings of many commands, initially using food as reinforcement and later switching to prey/toy rewards as their drives get stronger.

I also wanted to mention that the dog needs to be praised when he performs well, in this case, stopping the barking and insanity caused by the other dogs and cats.  Constant discipline without reward will wear on a dog's nerves and may exacerbate the problem.  As someone previously suggested, giving food when a dog comes by the fence is a positive association, although if you give it at the wrong time, he'll start to learn that when he gets worked up, he gets food.  Timing is key!  The lady needs to stop allowing the dog to reach that "red zone" state of mind in the first place, by crate-training him and only letting him out in the yard for an hour or so as a play time (aside from regular exercise), and when he has to go potty, keep him on a leash...the less time he spends in the yard, the less of a "claim" he will will feel he has on the property.  Dogs kept in the yard most of the time are very territorial. She needs to be in the yard with him the entire time he's out there, to keep an eye on him and to encourage positive behavior.

Electric collars work great for certain things.  Field trainers have been using them effectively for years.  That being said, I never ever, ever, ever, use them to stop an aggression problem. 

One of the cardinal rules I was taugt on the shock collar is to NEVER NEVER zap the dog off a person or animal.  I'll use it to teach come and get the dog to me BEFORE aggression escalates. I agree, sound like too mcuh dog. Putting stitches in another dog DOES sound pretty serious to me. She's lucky the owner didn't sue the crap out of her.

It would be cheaper and less drama just to buy a fence charger and place a barrier inside the exsisting fence.

E-collars can be harmful if used incorrectly.

Cats are fair game and make for good excersise.

Glitches today??

i don't happen to believe that electronics should ever be used to deter aggression.........and especially dog on dog aggression.  i believe electronics will escalate aggression and even more so with dog aggression.  first of all, he hates the other dog and tries to get it.  he gets a jolt, it pisses him off......now he really really hates the other dog.  the more this happens, the worse the issues will be.  the only way to control aggression is thru obedience.  i'm serious.  it is the only way.  until this dog owner gains control of this animal, there will continue to be problems.
pjp