THE KENNEL CLUB’S PLANS (UK) - Page 2

Yes... there are those kind of breeders too Brady Bee... it's still unreasonable to tar ALL with the same brush!

I have not said that the KC are totally to blame, however, they represent "dogdom" in our country, they take our money, they make the rules, they licence the shows, they REGISTER the litters... they should shoulder much of the responsibility, for they could have prevented much of what is wrong! 

missbeeb,this debate could go on and on and on,the kc have much to answer for,i probably have my own file there the amount of times i have written to them in the past. No body, so far, has tarred all breeders the same,not one person,these are your words no one elses.I still and will always think that breeders could have prevented much of what is going on today in the breed,one should be responsible for what they breed and "own up" to any "errors",instead of sweeping it under the carpet and hoping it might go away. I am afraid it does not wash with me that the kc are to blame for eveything,they may well take our money for registrations,but who takes the money for a puppy,that is knowingly sold to joe public,that may well not be as healthy in a years time as it is at 8 weeks. PLEASE EXUSE ME I HAVE A FUR BALL STUCK IN MY THROAT.  liz

THE KC DOES NOT MAKE THE DECISIONS ON WHICH DOG/BITCH TO BREED. 

CORRRRRRRECT, BRADYBEE  LIZ

Brady Bee - I agree with you that the KC does not decide which dog/bitches are bred.  However with the current systems there is no point where dogs become unsuitable for breeding.

Also there are dogs - not only in the GSD rings - that get good results when in reality the judge should have asked them to leave the ring.  As shows are licensed by the KC they should have enforced correct  temperment as much as confirmation and I believe we would not have things in quite the state they are in today.  2 years ago - my last trip to crufts - I was horrified at seening some dogs visibly cringe at the sight of strangers too close to them, and I did write and express my concern to the KC and it was not really responded to appropriately.

This year I have been out to some shows and again witnessed dogs of varying breeds showing totally inappropriate responses to both other dogs around the rings and to the judge.  In fact one table breed I witnessed - the dog was physically held up to be assessed by the judge - and lo and behold it won its class and went to be RES CC!  If the KC cannot see that dogs behaving like that should never be given good placings in the ring then we will never sort temperment issues.

On the other hand - It was fantastic to see at Richmond the GSD judge firstly staying out in the rain to work the dogs in the right environment and secondly banging his clipboard against his leg to see how the dogs responded.  So its shows that some judges have a brain cell and others unfortunately are blinded by looks and loose their marbles!

As dogs who do well in the ring gain higher demand in the breeding side of things - the KC must start to enforce things, both in setting limits for health screening and for what temperment is presented in the show ring.

The AKC in the US is solely a registry body... with no real ability to demand or enforce beneficial testing, certification for any breed... I'm assuming that the KC is the same way.  The GSDCA can set requirements at least at their specialty shows, for things like OFA, CERF, Von Wildebrands, Cardiac etc testing to have been done.  I know that a number of individuals within the American Parent club has tried to require that ALL Select and ROM prospects have at least an OFA certification... others have felt that they should have a minimum of a CD obedience degree.... but the Parent Club has not made this happen.

Unlike the SV in Germany which is both a registry AND a police body for the breed. The US and other countries have little oversight as to who gets bred and who doesn't, who gets shown and who doesn't... this is why there are so many "beauty Queens" in the ring here, who can't or don't have certifications of soundness, physical or mental.  It's easiest to turn to the registry body and complain about them, but it's the parent club, and the breeders who don't bother who are at fault.

Liz, the point I am making is this: if the KC had been responsible... the bad breeders would have had nowhere to go with their poor practices.  Of course breeders are to blame but not all breeders.

I have addressed my posts to Brady Bee because it was implied in his/her first post that all breeders were to blame... "the so called reputable breeders" I believe was the terminology.  I have no axe to grind with Brady Bee and I believe I'm correct in thinking that Brady Bee is not offended or upset about our exchanges?  We've exchanged posts previously without friction and I'd prefer to continue exchanging posts along similar lines.  

I find your posts to me a little antagonistic, therefore, without any intent to offend, I'd rather opt out from any further postings to/from you. 

missbeeb,just suits me fine,but would love to hear your definition of a "bad breeder". Never mind i'm sure i'll live without your answer!!!! WINDWALKER18 very good post.BEEPY can fully understand your comments on temperament,but there is a lot more going on than that,that IMO is as important. oh one last thing missbeeb BRADY BEE is just more tactful than me.  liz

Missbeeb:

You are correct that there a many reputable breeders who would like thing to change for the better but when those at the top get away with things that any other person did there is always going to a sour taste in some peoples mouths.

Just look at what is going on in Germany right now.

Also i just wanted to add a comment on another thread about the same issues that said this:

It has been said that small people in the breed will not be able to do anything to help with the breeds future, that is true in a way, but they can support those who are putting logical and well though out strategies.

Which i foundd very condescending as if you look at the show scene it is many of the small beeders that are the life blood of the breed, they keep show scene alive with their support .I' would also say they have a less biased view on things and would probably put forward ideas that helped everyone and not just those at the top.

Watcher

Very good post

Beepy

What we have to remember about what gets placed in the showring, is that most JUDGES  are BREEDERS---I rest my case