Head Shaking in prey drive on the sleeve - Page 2

I too like a dog that has some fight and shaking  not just bites and holds and lets the helper take him for a ride.  I have done helper work on both kinds of dogs.  It is a lot more fun to work the dog that fights back.  It also seems like they are less likely to get hurt than the dog the just bites, lifts his feet and holds on.  When you drive the dog he is easier to control if there is some resistance coming back from the dog, its also easier to feel wher he is.

I wish more dogs had this trait.

Shawn

I have observed dogs with lower or medium drives that have had work tend to shake less but the higher prey drive tend to be the ones that shake more. Not a 100% statement but never seen many lower drive dogs shake the head to kill.

I also like the to see the more intense drives.

Yes, finally people who like a dog with gritt!!!!!!!  Their is nothing like a well bred,raised and trained GSD that will bring the fight to the man and try and destroy him. This of course needs to be followed with a dog that has very good trainability (workability). I love to see the helper/agitator/bad guy show his discomfort through the equipment when the dog has him in his vice like gripp, and then like a shark tries to remove his arm from the body (sorry got carried away).

here I want to bring in the element of mouthiness and poor grip due to head shaking. Is this frequently observed that dogs who shake their head to kill the sleeve, have poor grips and it can lead to mouthiness

if some real life helpers can comment....

cheers

it is called fight drive.if you want to see a good example watch Fero Zu,or his Son Troll nachbershaft,or his brother timmy.this is immpresive and has nothing to do with bad nervs or anthing like that high fight drive dogs tend to show that kind of power in the fight.have a nice one.

I agree with Held.  It is fight drive.  Sad thing, is that we are seeing it less and less in the GSD because so many want the calm full grip that wins you points.    Most of the Malinois I have seen or worked have had excellent fight drive.  \

With the nerve issue, ya gotta know what you're looking at.  Is the dog displaying fight drive or is it getting chewy and hectic on the sleeve?  Is the dog displying fight drive or is he trying to get as far away from the helper as possible? 

I consider a dog that has a shallow bite but is shaking his head or very chewy with no power a nerve issue. What you want to see is a dog that shakes his head with a full mouth bite, and if he regripps its because he is trying to go deeper and harder that is the vision that should be desired. We need to start breeding dogs with the fight drive, not just dogs who hold on.   Very nice topic!!!!!!!!

My dog just started up with this and I wanted to revive the thread for further discussion. I know it's the prey aggression has kicked in, he's maturing still and becoming more serious/less game. My boy has always been a steady solid carrier of the prize and super calm on the grip. I'm having fun watching him rip the jacket off the decoys as they try and slip.

So, if shaking it is mainly considered prey/fight drive, would a very rough pulling motion tend to be in the same area? My male has a crushing grip, it's calm and powerful, but he's also fighting the whole time, pulling, tugging. But not the typical head shaking you guys are talking about. Is this just fight drive of a different sort? Or directly connected with this instinctive need to "kill" the prey, as with the head shake?

Emily.

what exactly is "Fight drive of a different kind"  elaborate. if anyone has to say that there are multiple "types" of fight drives?

I thought there was one fight drive which was a combination of constituent drives.