How much drive is too much? - Page 2

MVF how old is your pup? Allot can change in a few months time. Drives can kick in with age. Try talking to the breeder. My dogs breeder has always been right on with when changes will happena dn drives will increase. I was worried as a pup that my dog had no ball drive. He would chase the ball when he felt like it but wouldn't bring it back. Now he is a ball crazed nut job and will play ball for as long as my arm can throw. If I have the ball in my hand I can get that dog to do anything.

Drive has to be in balance with clarity.  as gsd2727 says, dogs that leak drive are difficult to work and a more moderate drive dog will be more sucessful.  Much depends on training and recognizning that the dog needs to learn to cap its drive to get the reward.

Drive is one factor.  Clarity.  Prey vs aggression.  Confidence.  A dog with confidence and much drive in social aggression and little prey does not work well on any but helpers who have presense and are threatening in their personality and stature.  Too few of those around and too many who are bred for extreme prey and become unclear.

4pack: Thanks.  I have a great breeder and she is a great resource.  I believe that this pup will be good and he is consistent with the development in her lines.   For example, her dogs don't generally like rags but then go for sleeves, and this guy seems to be of that ilk.  I have to confess that I have actually done SchH, in the past, as well, and even did some handling 20 years ago, but did not title my own dogs in protection.  This time I will give that a go.   My general concern, following the thread, is that my pup is most assuredly sane and calm and not as driven (if I understand that right) as many pups appear to be in descriptions I hear and videos I see.  Have you ever seen a steady pup become a flashy worker?  If not, have you ever seen a steady pup become a high scoring worker?  My worries are for what I have least experience with, protection.  I am confident I can score high 90s with him in OB and TR.

The other thing is that my pup is neither crated nor penned up for more than a few hours a day.  I write and grade papers and goof off on this database at home with him at my feet.  I am wondering if he is simply calmer than other pups because he is not crazy from being locked up all day.  Do you think that's a possibility?  I wonder if so-called drive is actually crate-stir-craziness?  If someone looked me up in a little box or even in a big pen all day, I'd be a lunatic when they let me out...

Crating would probably be a good idea for your dog if you want more of a response from him.  Many of us crate or kennel our dogs to give them some "quiet time" on their own.  This way they have more of an appreciation for working with you.  Sometimes when dogs (especially puppies) have unlimited time with their humans they are a little blase when it comes to actually working.  Also, most dogs like their crates as dogs are denning creatures and crates are like dens.

MVF I wouln't worry too much about your pup. If he is looking consistent with the lines and your breeder knows her stuff, he will mature into a working Sch dog. Like I said my guy is lazy too compaired to the spazfest in the next kennel over. He has a clear head, love for the work and ...finally the willingness to please me. I was affraid that would never happen. His laziness can be "fixed" if I don't work him for a few days or I kennel/crate him more. So far the drive has been good enough I don't have to do that.

I have an appretiation for the pups that are being lifted in the air at 6 weeks and snarling and biting anything that moves. They are fun to watch and someday I might go there but for now I am thankfull I have my calm thinker, he is a bit slower to mature and develope than other dogs I have owned but he is turning out nicer every day. That beats a pup that started out smokin' then fizzled. My pup always had a super grip and awesome nerves, he took a full mouth on the bite and stayed on at 5 weeks, that remained consistant into 8 weeks and I picked him. The drive to play was there, the cockiness was definatly there, and he was the most dominant in the litter. He was the slow and steady pup, noises, lights, new stuff didn't faze him and thats what I liked. Drives can change be molded and helped along. Crappy nerves can't be fixed, a shy puppy will probably be a shy dog.

I'm not experienced at all, but as a pet owner who appreciates even the requirements for real obedience, I'd like to comment.

Well, really I'd like to comment since I have a very faulty dog who just happens to be "high drive".

You acted as if high drive is in conflict with focus.  I guess that could happen.  But what I see is a dog with so much prey drive she WILL NOT pay attention to anything else when that drive is stoked.  She is SO FOCUSED on what drew her, that she can cause damage to herself (I wouldn't trust her to be careful crossing streets, etc, if chasing a cat, squirrel, whatever).

Never mind the fact that this extreme prey drive has driven her to kill several animals (bird, rabbit, groundhog) whether she intended or not (mostly she has left them lifeless, no longer interested when they won't move), with her bee-line attitude and her relentless powerful shaking of the animal.  I would not trust her with cats; I don't want her to kill someone's pet.

My old dog had plenty of "drive" and lots of guardian instinct but NOT "obsessive" and despite being dominant by nature (unlike my high-drive nut, who is submissive wimp by nature), was quite cool and collected and rather easy to control.  I personally think that is NOT a good trait.  I wonder if all the high drive people go on and on about as well as the attack training (not the training, but trying to get the "character" that is "best" suited for it) is what has really turned the breed into the stereotype people have had for some 40+ years of the GS as a "dangerous" dog.

My current GSD & the one before this are both extremely high drive dogs.  I have found this type of dog to be very rewarding, but it could be because from the beginning I was taught how to "cap" the drives, and how to work with this kind of dog, but I think it has more to do with the fact that both are extremely well bred dogs.  I think that as Drew mentioned, a lot has to do with how "balanced" the dog is, how clear in the head.   I do think the manner in which the dogs are raised & trained has a lot to do with it too, but not as big a roll as DNA.

Would you say that a "high drive" dog is one that never really relaxes in the house?  I think that in itself would drive me nutts. lol  I prefer the dog that is calm in the house, will go chill out in his favorite spot unless there's something going on he feels the need to go explore.  I can tell ya trying to get into the bathroom with 2 shepherds is NOT fun. lol  Why in the world do they feel the need to follow in there??  I can see the kitchen, but the bathroom?? lol  Unless they are afraid the tidy bowl man is gonna suck me down the toilet I can't imagine what they think is gonna happen to me in the bathroom???

Now I don't want a dog that literally lays on the couch when the doorbell rings or someone comes in and they don't even raise their head in curiousity....but I don't want one constantly racing to the window barking his head off every time a person walks by either. 

Anybody else wanna comment on this thread. I'd like to see it keep going.