Question on "pick of the litter" - Page 2

Sparrow, great question and excellent thread all.   We are watching how ours develops daily, which ones are first at something, which ones aren't quite as "pushy".  Amazing how at 2-weeks old you can already start seeing some differences.  Thanks for all the great comments you've all made.

I also agree with DR.  If you don't have that...what's the point?

Veronica

Ideally, all pups in a litter would be uniform in type and temperment and there would be no need to have "picks".  However, then reality sets in.  LOL.  I am not convinced that "puppy tests" can identify a winner.  However, I do believe they can weed out the bottom end.  If a puppy is clearly fearful or such, then that pup could be eliminated from the choice. 

Yvette

To answer the question if at 3 months do you know the quality of dog you have?

I will answer for myself. i spend alot of time imprinting , working and playing with my pups and by 13-14 weeks of age i know what i have.  since I always know the parents of the pup that helps in knowing what to expect. know the parents/pedigree is important to understanding what you are seeing from the pups. At about ten weeks of age we could tell which pups were the best natural trackers.

for example: the video I posted on two pups I was training and I could take them to any park or agility course and they had no problems. they were already tracking at this age and had passed many temperement tests that they had been exposed too almost from birth.

Recently I had "pick of the litter" for me that meant that I had first selection on the pup I wanted 4 males/4females. But I also had the fortune to be able and see this litter first hand at least once a week. I was looking for a high competition SchH prospect. I was looking for high food drive, high prey drive, environmentally stable, independant and confident charisma, and a pup who loved to be into and around everything including people, and yes more than likely a male, since I already had a female.

The pups were subjected to the Vollhard test and the pup I thought to be the 3rd pick of the Males and probably the 5th pick overall did the best of the test. I took it for what it was worth and made me relook over the litter again. I still think that the male was not the top of the litter and also was not as dominant as the two other males, the 4th male while the biggest was just way too laid back. I had two other males above the test winner and as the weeks progressed I was confident in my two candidates. The pup I chose was very even in drives thoughout the weeks. he did not seem to go up or down and was as good if not better than the majority of pups during the testing. He was very drivey but consistant, a dominant pup that for me turned out to be the pick of the litter. But it took me all the way up to 8 weeks before I was sure of my pick. Thank goodness for a paitent breeder.

I have had the little guy for 3 weeks now and so far he has turned out to be great. He is a monster, who fears nothing, non stop on the rag, retrieves balls, and will take your hand off for a piece of hotdog. That and he has, nice size, great color and a great czech pedigree. For me I have no doubts that he was the pick of the litter. I am also happy that the #2 male is going to the breeder's wife and #1female is going to the breeder's brother whom all train in our club. The breeder already had the #1 female from the previous breeding who was 8months of age and both of the parents whom I had worked several times each. For me this was a no brainer for the litter... but the "pick of the litter" was a different story.

I do agree though it is what you look for in a pup, as in this case their was a woman who wanted a SAR dog that could live with kids. The 4th male fit this category. He had very high food drive, nice prey drive but not over the top, good retrieving skills, confident and outgoing, environmentally solid, but he also tended not to be as much of a biter and as dominant as some of the others even though he was clearly one of the biggest pups. For this woman she had different needs and requirements. My opinion is find a great breeder, who knows his/her stuff and can match you with the pup that fits your needs. Then and only then will you get "Pick of the Litter".

sparrow,  hopefully this will help you some too...   I had a long time breeder, schH traininer friend of mine come and help me pick some pups to hold back for training,  well.... she told me a story while were doing this,  that she had held 2 pups from a litter of hers,  they were at 9 weeks of age the Highest drive pups in the litter,  well at 12 weeks one of her picks had become very mellow and one of the mellower pups had become very high drive,  she said that is what "stuck" so one of her picks had completely flip flopped,  and apparently it's not all that uncommon of a phenomenon to have pups go through many stages of drive before they're level is determinable....   sure enough one of the picks we had made,  by 12 or 13 weeks,  one had turned into a complete couch potato,  She said it was my fault she still says "Mitch you couched it out of that dog" with a laugh of course.    Anyway thought I would share that it had been shared with me,  and if it helps some then great.   Picking a pup is always tough,  But your breeder will be willing to help you,  they have seen the pups from day 1 and will have a better idea of each pups current and past "personality"  allow the breeder to help you make the choice that is "right" for you.  Best of Luck to you and I hope you get a dandy !!

"Pick of the Litter" is exactly that!  It is merely the first "pick".  It depends on who is picking the pup and what they are looking for.  It depends on the knowledge of the person doing the "pick".  You and I may be looking at very different things.  After the pick many variables exist.  Socialization, training, genetics, and environment all play a major role in which puppy will meet it's full potential.  If you go to a respectable breeder, they should be able to tell you everything.  A respectable breeder should be taking notes of everything.  Whether it is mental or on paper, they should know what they have.  A respectable breeder doesn't want the wrong puppy to go to the wrong hands. 

A while back, I had the "second pick" of the females in a litter of five females.  They were all nice and uniform.  The lady with the "first pick" was there as well.  We had all of them out and I had my eye on one of them.  I had my poker face on and didn't say a word.  I was only waiting for them to take the fat puppy she and her daughter were fondling the whole time.  I was waiting for them to take "fatty", so I could seperate the rest individually for testing.  Needless to say, they ended up taking the one I had my eye on.  I tested the rest and ended up with "fatty".  When I returned to their club a few months later, I was astounded and pleased at the difference in the pups.  In my mind, I ultimately ended up with the better pup.  Was it training, genetics, maturity, socialization or environment?  I believe all of them played a role.