too many puppies!!!!!!!! - Page 2

If you have a litter puppies and the are akc paperd then darken in  the limited box if not for breeding!!Get a fix it cont. and check on it call the vet get a bill from him,or do like I do give some $ back for the fix it cont, its that simple.Whin thay know that thay will get $ back thay will do it asap.Sunsilver makes a good point on the high-drive dogs.The only good thing about thim going ot the pound is thay will get fix.     thanks mark                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                     

I feel that the problem is not a simple one.  There are so many varibles that need to be addressed.  I feel that if the responsible breeders would get involved with the law makers that are trying to pass these bills, it would help.  I, for one, am very active in the Ohio bill 606.  What I have done is taken each section, broke it down, wrote the pros and cons, my suggestions, and I contact the Represenitives on a weekly basis.  I do not agree with the whole bill, in general, but it makes some good points.  As I have told them, one of the many problems is Animal Control/Dog Wardens not doing their jobs, or able to do their jobs, properly.  There is a so called breeder in Columbus right now that has numberous complaints with the BBB, Ohio Attorney General, is passing herself off as "retired" law enforcement, a file a mile thick with the Humane Society, complaints with the Dog Warden.....YET EVERY YEAR IS ALLOWED TO HAVE A KENNEL LICENCE!!!!  Can anyone else see what is wrong with that????  I think that if more breeder checked the "limited Reg." box, people would be less likely to purchase a dog from them.  As pointed out in another thread - some people buying a dog do NOT want the breeder to have the right to tell them what to do with that dog once it's sold!  Then again, who's to say what is right or wrong when it comes to breeding/selling dogs?  What may work for one reputable, responsible, honorable breeder, may not work for another!!! 

An AKC limited registration will not prevent a dog from being bred, it will only prevent the progeny from being registered with AKC. They can still be registered with a number of other splinter registries such as AKA (Amercan Kennel Association) and there are plenty of others. Not sure if they are eligible for UKC registration without AKC registration. Around here, in the heart of the PA Amish puppymills, it's rare to see dogs that are AKC registered, most use one of the other registries. They stopped using AKC to stay out of the system that required a paperwork trail for every litter. Now they are free to name parentage without proof and are no longer subject to AKC scrutiny.

Following SV rules and only breeding to and from titled dogs and those with breed sruveys would dramatically cut down on the number of dogs offered for sale on this site alone. It would also eliminate a lot of the arguing here over the merits of breeding dogs with traits that are named as serious faults in the SV breed standard.  Dream on................. 

Blitzen, I totally agree! But this is America after all, and any attempt to tell Joe Average what to do is going to result in immediate cries of "NAZIS!!" "FREEDOM OF SPEECH" "LIVE FREE OR DIE!!"

So the backyard breeders and puppy mills just continue to churn out their litters, and the rest of us pay for it in taxes when the animals are turned into the pound and euthanized....

Arrrghhh....don't get me started on that whole can of worms...[sigh]

I've been hanging around Yahoo Answers a bit lately, and it seems like every third post under the cat and dog forums is: my cat/dog is only (fill in the blank, but keep the number under 12!!!) months old. Can she be pregnant?

It's idiots like that which have made the California legislation necessary.

Yee, Sunsilver I of all people know exactly what you mean too. I've gotten into a lot of trouble here by suggesting that dogs that aren't eligible for a breed survey might not be good breeding candidates. What does the SV know, right?

HB 1634 has its own website and, frankly, if I weren't a long time dog person, I could probably buy into some of their propaganda particularly the part about the money it costs the taxpayers to take care of the business of shelter dogs. Dog breeders everywhere had better soon get the picture, most of the world wants us gone forever and legislators like Levine say - so what if you can't buy a puppy/kitten born in CA. Go to a petshop and buy one imported here. Dangerous man.

OOOHhh, yeah, buy one from Asia, preferrably China, of course, where they raise large dogs for food, and feed them grain-based foods laced with melamine to (supposedly) boost the protein content!

They'd make great pets, wouldn't they?

Yeah, Levine's a real rocket scientist, isn't he? I  understand he's also a PETA member and gladly accepts campaign donations from that orgainization.

If that bill passes the CA senate, the only hope left is that Arnold the governator will veto it when it gets to his desk. So far he's not saying one way or the other what he will do. There will be an exemption for "guide dogs" so look for a whole new crew of GSD breeders to promote their dogs as guide dogs. anything for a buck, the motto that got us to where we are today with most breeds of dogs.

Sunsilver I don't recall stating only puppy mill pups end up in shelters. Any dog can end up in a shelter or pound. All they have to do is leave your property for a second. I do think most BYB are a little more ethical with who they place their pups with. A puppy miller does not ask questions at all. If you have $ they will sell you the pup, wrong matchup or not. I'm not saying EVERY BYB does a good screening job but most try. As deceptive as people are these days. If you breed dogs, you must be prepaired to keep them all if homes are not  found by 8 weeks. The believe motre people shouldn't even breed the 2 dogs until they have a list of buyers for that breeding.

 @##$%^&***!!

I got so distracted by that gorgeous Quantum daughter at the bottom of the page that I hit on the ad, and LOST MY WHOLE POST!!!    Is she ever a beauty! (Could have darker pigment, though...)

Okay, I'll try to reconstruct it.

4pack I couldn't agree with you more! And most responsible breeders DO wait until they have a list of names before breeding.

Still, I get the feeling from some people that their attitude is, "Oh, I do everything right when I breed (OFA, titles, etc.) therefore I'M not part of the problem!" Well, if you breed more litters than you can sell, then yes, you ARE part of the problem!

And it bugs me to no end that PETA is being so obnoxious that even legitimate animal rescue organizantions are getting a bad rap. People are afraid to donate money to them, in case it goes to fund the lunatic fringe, who go around opening cages at dog shows....GRRRRRRR!!!

Perhaps I need to clarify..... genetically sound, healthy pups with the capacity for work are sought by people who need and seek dogs like this for service/working or competition discipilines. There are always buyers looking to find a pup to serve this role.

On the pet side of things, pet buyers want a dog that is sound, healthy, solid temperament but not too driveful and that's okay too. It's a shame to put a great dog with "power"  into a pet home that just wants a lesser drive dog. Generally speaking, it's a mismatch.

But unfortunately, most pet buyers locate their new puppy from the local classified ads. The majority of classified ads are backyard breeders and not puppy mills, unless you want to classify these people as puppy mills. In general, puppy mills are considered to be someone that breeds several breeds and soley relies on this income.

In our newspaper, I have seen as low as 4 puppy ads for gsds and up to 15 at any given weekend. The more popular lab is typically between 15-28 puppy ads at almost any weekend. Multiply this by at least 8 puppies in a litter and this is how many puppies that are available each weekend for one area. These lab ads are predominately back-yard breeders. And labs have their health and temperament issues also.

The point is that back-yard breeders unknowingly often produce an "inferior product". How do I know?

We work in the pet industry and the weak nerved gsds from backyard breeders are difficult dogs to handle for us in the boarding industry and as trainers. There's not alot that can be done with them, other than neutralize and manage. The health issues are the obvious. Backyard breeders know, no standards or understanding of responsibility.

As for limited reg., you are preaching to the choir. We use limited reg. for pet homes. But if someone has titled or been involved in service dogs, then we will sell a dog with full reg. and allow them to be responsible to do the right thing. Common sense must prevail.

Whether or not you agree, that's was my point.