Has dog training actually improved. - Page 13

zdog point well taken. I thought  myself that the tester was pushing it little bit too far myself, but not far enough for me to stop it. I was actually not pulling dog just forward but back to my leg to give him little  confidence which he was getting from contact with me. At least that is what I was trying to do.  Dog was only about 1 year old.  As far as tying the dog   to the post alone would not be appropriate in my opinion for the dog of this age. The presence of the person he knew all his life was in my opinion necessary to help the dog where if he would be alone at this age this type of a sustained  pressure would be too much.  Dog is still with me and I will post some videos of him when I get time to make some . I am attaching picture of his less serious brother Scarface when in order to get alert look   he got "alert" command during picture taking session to great chagrin of my wife Debbie who wore less then appropriate foot ware for the occasion and did some water skiing. Scarface is now security dog  in private  possession in NW.  By the way I will demo the dog from  the video during our seminar in AZ in March. So you or anybody can come and see real civil dog.    Forget videos they are always inadequate in one way or another and can not show true reality same way as when you are present.  But that was a different topic. 
Prager Hans

Prager wrote;

Workingdogz I am glad that you are intertained. But what I said is not about TOS but about your character.

And once again Prager, coming from someone of your ilk,
I consider that a compliment. 

workingdogz,
I agree with much of what you have written here, the problem is you are discussing training with a dog broker. His interrests lay in selling dogs,period.
Mike

I am pulling out the rosey glasses . Dog training is better today.  When I started in my journey of dog training and the GSD. I was guided by the experts of that day. I was challanged, I was mentored, I was motivated, and I received criticism. I see far more people today reaching higher levels, and those are  levels higher than yesteryear. We, the enthusast,  of that day were amazed by anyone who had placed a SchH 1 on a dog. We thought anyone who had taken a dog to a Sch3 was a god. I am thankful to see more people doing better and better things all of the time. I have read many books and they help fill in gaps of understanding but on certain exercises the dog kept knocking the book out of my hand, so .......I have found learning from others better than the books for true education. Dog training has gotten better!! I am the benefactor of a full circle experience where people I have watch coming up thru the ranks are now accomplished trainers and are giving back to the breed and the sport! train don't complain.

GSDStudent. With all due respect. There are exceptions to both sides . But besides that so called better results are here 
 because back then the titles were achieved by more difficult rules  and not because there are better trainers. The rules were sissified  in name of accommodating lesser abilities of trainers. Look up the rules. 
Also sport is not all the training  which is  done nor it is a measure of training abilities in general. Also results are not measure of all things because results do not justify the means. Also the purpose of the training back then was different it was directed towards practical results and not how pretty the  performance was as it is doene today. 

 WorkingGSDs 
That is a laugh. Broker? Is that all what I am? Yes, I sell dogs and also I   have personally trained  hundreds  of dogs and was personally  assisting  in training of thousands of dogs in decades, all over the world  in all areas of  behavior modification, handicapped support dog training, obedience practical and obedience of sport, sport, personal protection, all aspects of law enforcement,  detection, non S&R tracking of all kinds,   and S&R and some other and I have conducted seminars on such and have started many kennels and their training programs and have teach many people to be successful trainers.   How many dogs have you trained and for what? 
I have learned that people like you, that is people  who have urge to go on public forums and anonymously and thus cowardly snipe at others  are people which did not achieved much themselves or are just arm chair generals and in order to  thwart their inferiority complex they then need to attack others. 
Good luck with that. 
Prager Hans

Dog training has changed. Unfortunately dog trainers have not. You can't put 2 in a room, and have them agree on anything. One always knows best.
Just like being married. Very sad!!!

 You can't put 2 in a room, and have them agree on anything. One always knows best.


Sure you can; you can put three dog trainers in a room and two will agree on what the third is doing wrong.  

Agree Slamdunc, but 3 in a room is scary thought! I dread to think of the amount of blood that could be spilt. I enjoy a debate, but then

Dog training whether for sport, SAR, Guide dogs, Police or Military working dogs has evolved over the past 20 or so years.  It has changed and for the better; the results speak for themselves in every discipline.  Successful trainers constantly evaluate the methods that work and have proven results.   They evolve and their methods evolve as well.  Too many trainers only train at their own "facility," field or training club and are not exposed to what others are doing.  I know some SchH trainers that are still using the techniques they learned in Europe over 30 years ago, their pride and arrogance will not allow them to venture out and learn from others that are far more successful now.  Sure, dogs were trained 30, 40, 50, 100 years ago, but methods have changed, techniques have changed and equipment has changed.  Rule changes have little to do with it for LE or MWD training for SAR or Guide dog training.  Good trainers keep an open mind and are able to take what works and use it to their advantage.  I hope that I never become so myopic or arrogant that I stop learning from others and remain willing to learn new techniques to improve my training and my dog's performance.   

What I find the most confounding is those that state they don't do "sport" and "sport" training is some how not beneficial or appropriate.  IMO, sport training develops reliability, accuracy, dependability and precision.  Whether you are a pet owner, Military handler, LE K-9 handler, SAR, Guide dog handler, etc those skills are desirable for every aspect of owning or working a dog.  Focused heeling is not necessary for a K-9, but precision, reliability and control absolutely are.  I have certainly adopted things from my SchH background that have enhanced our K-9 unit.  I suppose the ones that knock sport work are the ones that have never really participated or were successful at it.  

Slamdunk...Its not that some people never got far or did not partcipate, its the fact that some people realize that there is no return on your investment when you compete.
You spend a year or two training, paying club fees, weekly fees, dedicating 3-5 days a week to this endeavor. It takes time, effort, money and sacrifice, a lot of sacrifice...and in the end, what do you get out of this investment? NOTHING...a trophy if you win, maybe a ribbon. 
You made a post in a thread a few days a go that said if you went to work and all you got were accolades and praise, it would not last long...and I cant blame you, you cant pay your mortgage or your phone or whatever with your trophy. 
Until competing becomes profitable, if you win of course, until the sport becomes a business, I dont see much participation or it growing like it did in the past when it was new and exciting. Sure, there are benefits to training, sure there are benefits to owning a trained dog, but compete...and no return on that investment, I dont see it. Perhaps you have a different opinion and if so, I would like to hear it.