a stamp - Page 1

I just read an article in a local newspaper about a new k9 that had an a stamp on his hips. According to the article an a stamp means that for 25 generations there was no evidence of hip dysplasia.  I always thought it was for the individual dog.  Who is right?

the dog would of been  hip cert. but his parents would have pass too  and so on back.
 

if he did not pass there would be a breeding ban and you would not beable to A stamp any of those dogs pups.

Sounds like a bit of a fabrication.........




OFA is the American certifying institution.....

excellent, good and fair with our OFA is the same as (a)1 with Germany's SV or Czech or Slovakia Kennel Clubs rate them as "A"  or 0/0. Other countries have other ways of rating hips.

In Germany, Slovakia and Czech republic, the dog must be at least 1 year old. OFA requires a dog to be at least 2 years.


The SV takes heridity into account when it gives a ZW grading #.....  actual hip grade (a)1, (a)2, (a)3 ..... is straight off of the X-Ray.

DavC,
that statement is kind of silly.
Any puppy with SV pink papers can make that claim because since the early 60s, all dogs permitted to be used for breeding had to have an a-stamp.
So, that statement is right and wrong.
Wrong because the a-stamp is, as you mentioned an indication of the individual dog's hips, and any dog with FCI recognized registration papers (yes, also AKC) is eligible to be entered into the SV breed book and could get an a-stamp under that system. But of course, this dog most likely could not make that statement of that many generations of hd free dogs. We all know that this is completely voluntary here and maybe in other countries as well.
Right because if that dog was bred in Germany or any other country where screening for hips has been mandatory for as long as the SV mandated it. But again, it has nothing to do with the dog's own a-stamp, only with the history and origin. Even if the dog was completely dysplastic, that statement would still be true, unfortunately.
Chris

"...that statement is kind of silly."

Even sillier when you consider that in a lot of our lines, 25 generations takes us back almost to the inception of the breed!

A dog from the SV that has (a)3, or (a)4 hips has HD but the stamp still has an "a"..........

Only dogs that are intended for breeding are required to have their hips graded.

The article didn't say what grade a stamp the dog has.  Kinda  figure it was part of the sales pitch for the dog.  I asked about hid pedigrre and only got that he was from Holland.  From the pictures in the newspaper the dog looks slightly oversized.

The a-stamp (or a better definition is: certification) is only awarded to dogs who have a1 to a3 grading (the a1-a6 grading system has nothing to do with the "stamp" which is the "seal" the dog gets stamped into the pedigree).
a4 is moderate HD, a5 severe HD and a6 is for dogs with foreign certification (without further grading, just passing).
a4 and a5 have an automatic breed book ban, meaning no offspring will ever the eligible for registration with the SV. a6 is for dog with hips certified in foreign countries. Some are recognized by the SV, some are not. Among the ones being recognized, only a few European ones are allowed to be used for a breed survey in Germany. Example: OFA certification is recognized but you can not use that hip certification in Germany to go to a breed survey. Hips have to be redone. But for a breed survey here in the U.S. under an SV judge, it is permitted.
To be more specific, I will need to contact the SV to check if hips certified in the Czech Republic and in Slovakia are now recognized. Back in the days, when I organized breed surveys for our club here, we were given specific instructions that the SV did not recognize them. As a matter of fact I remember one case specifically where the breed survey was pending an OFA certification. It was a Czech female with a Czech certification. I also noticed that the Czech dogs living in Germany are all "a-stamped".
Chris

Keith Grossman is right. This is hardly even possible. I clearly remember in the late 70's and early 80's, seeing a LOT of pedigrees on popular, prominent stud dogs which did not even have all grandparents 'a' stamped. If a dog's average reproductive life is about six years (averaged for dogs and bitches, dogs can go a bit longer), then half that to find another average.. about three years, which is very reasonable. Most dogs have produced viable, successful offspring by the time they are three. So, if you figure each generation is an absolute minimum of three years (and this is being generous), to get 25 generations, you'd be looking at 75 years. The first international symposium on hip dysplasia ratings and standards occurred (I think in Sweden) in 1960, from my understanding. But, not all countries jumped on it right away, and it didn't become mandatory in the SV registry for many years after that.. It might have been around 1980 or later. But even if the SV was starting right away (in 1960), that would bring us to year 2035, we'd still need another approximately 25 years to come to the point where these dogs had consistently 25 generations of good hips solidly behind them.

As a point aside, what about the many breeders in the SV system who have cheated? Remember, there's a lot of money in this for them, and DNA only came into the picture recently. A vet tech here at a well known DVM's office told me that the same <ahem> police dog trainer / contractor was coming in with the same dog, over and over, to get OFA's on the dogs he sold. Do you think he was the only one to do this? OFA finally had to put some controls on THAT, as well, by digitizing and comparing hip x-rays.

Put on your critical thinking caps, people!

The one thing you CAN tell by this article, which is consistently true, is that contemporary journalism is in the toilet and should be considered as "entertainment" and advertising / propaganda, only. Sadly, most journalists just crank this stuff out, copying from one another and making stuff up. I doubt that there's anything like serious fact finding and research going on.

So, where would they get this clap-trap? Maybe the police media liason???? They feed directly to the local newspapers and newswires. Their job is to help manage public opinion. In this case, they might want the public to think they got something really valuable for their money, i.e. a "wonderdog".

Now that I think of it, I've been over-generous in my assumptions.

I was basing the six year breeding lifetime of the dog on the years between 2 and 8 years, before which large breeds with breed testing are generally not being used, and after which they are generally over the hill or passed over for newer, more interesting dogs.

The average age of a producing dog or bitch might be much closer to 4 years of age. The only way to verify this would be with a very large databank and statistical analysis. But I think that this is very reasonable. At least 3.5 years age, let's say.. which would mean that by the time the second generation is reaching the age where they have produced a viable litter with good quality offspring, we are looking at 7 to 8 years of age.

If you multiply 25 generations of 'a' stamped ancestors, by this adjusted number, you'd be looking at something closer to 100 years.. Which would take us back to the relative beginnings of the breed.

Just another example of insanely stupid "news" reporting. Thankfully, someone noticed this and seemingly asked themselves, "What's wrong with this picture".  Why don't you write a letter to the editor and point out the error in this statement? That would be fun!!!