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by steve1 on 04 March 2010 - 09:03
So many threads on here start off good more so when one of the Guys posts Pic.s or Videos of there Dog working in some form or other then get slated for doing it by others who pick up what they consider faults, then we get some folk on here who Poo Hoo the idea of Training say a Dog for the Schutzund Sport and they pass it off as of no account in a lot of instances, But i will not elaborate on that
What do these same People who do not rate ScH Training in all three Phases that is OBED TRACKING And PROTECTION
What are there ideas of training there Dogs, what do they expect from the Dog before they can tell other people my Dog is trained in a high degree of Obedince, What do they consider good training
Now there are many on here who do the above so let us here there views on it, It could make a good debate if things are kept truthfull and Civel, To end it is everyones choice of what they do with there dog, and no talk will change that, so Guys let us here from you about the training or not of your Dogs, and i mean the ones who are not working there Dogs in the ScH Sport, or say any other form of working there Dogs to do a sport or work
Steve1
What do these same People who do not rate ScH Training in all three Phases that is OBED TRACKING And PROTECTION
What are there ideas of training there Dogs, what do they expect from the Dog before they can tell other people my Dog is trained in a high degree of Obedince, What do they consider good training
Now there are many on here who do the above so let us here there views on it, It could make a good debate if things are kept truthfull and Civel, To end it is everyones choice of what they do with there dog, and no talk will change that, so Guys let us here from you about the training or not of your Dogs, and i mean the ones who are not working there Dogs in the ScH Sport, or say any other form of working there Dogs to do a sport or work
Steve1
by Vixen on 04 March 2010 - 11:03
From reading this Thread, it brought to mind on two previous occasions whereby I was told that myself and dogs could not compete in the Obedience Section of Schutzund because they were too precise.
I wonder if anyone could explain Why?
It has been something that has puzzled me, as surely looking to progress in any of these three disciplines is aiming for improvement and concentration (both Handler and Dog), that will begin to develop more accuracy? To be penalised for this seems rather strange to me.
Vixen
I wonder if anyone could explain Why?
It has been something that has puzzled me, as surely looking to progress in any of these three disciplines is aiming for improvement and concentration (both Handler and Dog), that will begin to develop more accuracy? To be penalised for this seems rather strange to me.
Vixen
by steve1 on 04 March 2010 - 11:03
Vixen
I am not aware of these threads you speak of However It all depends on what degree of Obed you are talking about,
Yes, to me If we are talking about the ScH sport then Obed is the most important thing to achieve a high standard of
Why i say that is because in the other two disciplines there is also a lot of Obed required from the Dog as well so if you do not have that high Obed with your Dog then no matter how well a Dog may bite in Protection it will lose too many points on the way in the phase of Competition, Also in Tracking a good degree of Obed is required from the Dog to really get the best Score possible
However what is your term of a Dog being Obed that is what this thread is all about,
Steve1
I am not aware of these threads you speak of However It all depends on what degree of Obed you are talking about,
Yes, to me If we are talking about the ScH sport then Obed is the most important thing to achieve a high standard of
Why i say that is because in the other two disciplines there is also a lot of Obed required from the Dog as well so if you do not have that high Obed with your Dog then no matter how well a Dog may bite in Protection it will lose too many points on the way in the phase of Competition, Also in Tracking a good degree of Obed is required from the Dog to really get the best Score possible
However what is your term of a Dog being Obed that is what this thread is all about,
Steve1
by Vixen on 04 March 2010 - 12:03
Thank you Steve. Actually, I was referring to this particular Message. (Perhaps there are areas of expectation that are different in the UK).
However, my own 'problem' aside. I agree that Obedience can not simply be a performance! (That too seems to be happening in the UK). Obedience needs to build respect and rapport. The Handler should be able to over-ride a given situation, not just when it suits the dog!
This is where progress is required. If an Owner reaches a certain level and is happy, fine, who are any of us to criticise. But if they wish to progress further, then they need to learn and be aware of detail, and far more regarding the way of a dog. They also require appropriate help in what to look for, and how to attain it, that communicates correctly to the dog.
Whenever, I hear of a certain behavioural problem with a dog, I know this is not the problem, it is a symptom of the actual problem.
Hope this helps contribute to your original Message.
Regards,
Vixen
However, my own 'problem' aside. I agree that Obedience can not simply be a performance! (That too seems to be happening in the UK). Obedience needs to build respect and rapport. The Handler should be able to over-ride a given situation, not just when it suits the dog!
This is where progress is required. If an Owner reaches a certain level and is happy, fine, who are any of us to criticise. But if they wish to progress further, then they need to learn and be aware of detail, and far more regarding the way of a dog. They also require appropriate help in what to look for, and how to attain it, that communicates correctly to the dog.
Whenever, I hear of a certain behavioural problem with a dog, I know this is not the problem, it is a symptom of the actual problem.
Hope this helps contribute to your original Message.
Regards,
Vixen
by Two Moons on 04 March 2010 - 17:03
Hi Steve,
As you know I am one who doesn't do Schutzhund but trains my dogs in obedience and some tracking, tracking mostly for fun.
I have trained dogs in the past for protection but now only a bit of stranger awareness do to circumstances.
I well trained dog means obedient first, you can't have the others until you have the basic foundation.
Well trained means obedient regardless of the situation, distractions, or activity, %100 percent.
None of mine would rate %100 percent, thats my fault not the dogs.
I rate my dogs on Intelligence by observing how quick they learn, how often they outsmart me, and problem solving.
As far courage I must either present a situation or wait for one to appear like strangers pulling in the driveway, or the Coyotes investigating up close when I butcher.
Plus how the dog reacts to gun fire, a sudden startle, or someone agitating the dog.
Observed natural ability is also something I rate,
herding instinct, guarding and protecting, tracking, and will the dog really bite something or only nip at it.
How does the dog react to a snake is interesting and shows many abilities.
Intelligence is the easiest to see. Does the dog follow my rules once taught.
Personality and loyalty is also important to me and has much to do with everything.
Thats how I rate my dogs.
I am one who thinks Schutzhund is great, but lacking in some areas.
Moons.
As you know I am one who doesn't do Schutzhund but trains my dogs in obedience and some tracking, tracking mostly for fun.
I have trained dogs in the past for protection but now only a bit of stranger awareness do to circumstances.
I well trained dog means obedient first, you can't have the others until you have the basic foundation.
Well trained means obedient regardless of the situation, distractions, or activity, %100 percent.
None of mine would rate %100 percent, thats my fault not the dogs.
I rate my dogs on Intelligence by observing how quick they learn, how often they outsmart me, and problem solving.
As far courage I must either present a situation or wait for one to appear like strangers pulling in the driveway, or the Coyotes investigating up close when I butcher.
Plus how the dog reacts to gun fire, a sudden startle, or someone agitating the dog.
Observed natural ability is also something I rate,
herding instinct, guarding and protecting, tracking, and will the dog really bite something or only nip at it.
How does the dog react to a snake is interesting and shows many abilities.
Intelligence is the easiest to see. Does the dog follow my rules once taught.
Personality and loyalty is also important to me and has much to do with everything.
Thats how I rate my dogs.
I am one who thinks Schutzhund is great, but lacking in some areas.
Moons.
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