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by Nicole H on 06 September 2009 - 15:09
Hi Tiina,
the Problem is...Obi...his parents are not white.
Greetings
Nicole
by Alpinarc on 07 September 2009 - 21:09
by Nicole H on 08 September 2009 - 06:09
The FCI says absolutely no. So OBI may actually in no FCI country into the breed.
In netherland Obi is father too, that was also forbidden (of the FCI)
I do not find some rules good, but it may not be, which makes which each country it wants.
That is valid also for the papers. Some countries write dogs into the papers, which may not stand there.
Obi could have been determined phenotype. Then it would be in the breed, but without ancestor.
In Germany we have many dogs in the breed, where the Pedigree is empty. Because of the acknowledgment of the race, the ancestors were taken over not of the FCI.
There stands, not after VDH/FCI guidelines bred.
I find that naturally very unfortunate.
It takes now a great many years, to we with these dogs and its children, a full Pedigree gotten. We receive puppies for its only certificates of register not a Pedigree.
by Tina13 on 08 September 2009 - 16:09
What stop you from using that male? Yes I know Obi's parents are coloured.
But since other breeders can using dogs with no 3 generation white. Is it your wss club that says no or is it the kennel club?
And if the dog has an empty pedigree, can you use the dog then? even if the dog has coloured ancestor?
by Ironbabe on 08 September 2009 - 16:09
by Tina13 on 08 September 2009 - 16:09
Another one then...let's say I have a female after coloured parents or there are coloured parents in the pedigree and here you can use this female and still register the puppies.
I want to use a german male..Is that ok for you or will your kennel club say no?
by Nicole H on 08 September 2009 - 18:09
the kennel Club say no..and the FCI say no too.
by Sicro on 12 September 2009 - 23:09
To me they make no sense at all, nevertheless the White Swiss Shepherd is genetically nothing else than a German Shepherd and breeding rules should be there to improve - not to restrict the breed!
I can not understand why other countries simply compass these rules and countries like Germany just undergo them, even if they don`t like them!
It is up to the breeding clubs or to the international governing bodies, like the BBI or FBBSI in Europe for example, to do something against it, like:
- prove to the FCI the narrow genetical gene pool of the breed
- show them the identical genetic code (DNA) of the White Swiss Shepherd and the German Shepherd
- explain and proof them the genetical inheritance by Mendel concerning the recessive gene for the hair colour White
- present them the simplest mating schemes to avoid the occurrence of coloured dogs
And - that doesn`t mean that we would be allowed to mate White and Coloured, but just accept some Coloureds in the backend of the pedigree...
But - as long as we just accept it ( and just moaning doesn`t help!) obviously nothing will change...
Best regards,
Sicro
by Nicole H on 14 September 2009 - 14:09
lÜbersetzung
by Ceph on 21 September 2009 - 14:09
I generally feel that alot of the restrictions faced in Germany and Switzerland are a little tight, especially with a developing breed. It's causing (at least in my opinion) a movement away from the working oriented breed to a more pet oriented breed (certainly not the case all the time, but it seems to be a more frequent trend).
Something I wondered was why not set up a Keuring system -- not unlike the German Warmblood Horses have. Wait until the dog has reached maturity and then look at structure, health, genes and temperment and determine whether or not the dog brings something to the WSS gene pool. This could be done with Whites imported from non-FCI affiliate clubs such as AWSA in the US, as well as with outstanding examples of the GSD breed that might fit the structural or temperment requirements of the WSSD. For the dogs that are approved, they can then be listed in a stock registry that is approved for breeding to the main registry...and they and their offspring can remain in the stock registry until they have three generations of an approved registry or white in their background.
Hold something like this keuring twice a year, and maintain an inspection of the offspring for three generations and you generally take care of the issue of different countries using different lines. In fact -- you'll probably see a move towards similarity, not unlike how many of the german warmblood breeds have started to resemble each other.
~Cate
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