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by Shtal on 03 October 2013 - 02:10
by Shtal on 03 October 2013 - 05:10
This thread/video will help explaining vk4 position and his world view based on what vk4 wrote: see if that can get turned into an idiotic rant about creation fairy-tales. http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/forum.read?mnr=749859-a-young-shtal
by beetree on 03 October 2013 - 09:10
. 
by Hundmutter on 03 October 2013 - 11:10
At the beginning of the video, there is an implication (I'm being
kind; he actually says he will do it: 02:05 - 03:30) that he is going to
supply a single, distinct, succinct argument giving the 'ultimate proof
of creation', a conclusion that cannot logically be countered by non-
Christians.
So why 3/4 of an hour later has he still not given us that ? He
has just argued his worldview for 50 minutes. That is not a distinct
'proof', let alone a succinct one. I doubt the book he is selling does
it either.
He starts from a false preposition in any case. When he says:
"All presuppositions start from the Bible" and he claims that there is no
logic which does not 'stand on the Bible / word of god', he is arguing
from a false starting point. My immediate question Is "Why ? - Why do
I have to acknowledge that "the fear of the lord is the beginning of knowledge".
The secular argument against that view is NOT "well I know some non-Xians
who know some things", it is "WHO SAYS ???". [Answer: only those who
believe in the validity of their bible.]
He also uses the same old tired arguments re genetics, carbon-dating,
etc that have been rubbished as lines of evidence in Hovind's lectures;
just going on repeating assertions and saying they are accurate, despite
scientific findings to the contrary, does not make them true. Most of the
'arguments' he credits to the non-Christian (eg neutrality) are NOT positions
taken by the secular when arguing against 'blind faith', in my experience, so
learning Lisle's way of countering those would appear to be useless anyway.
kind; he actually says he will do it: 02:05 - 03:30) that he is going to
supply a single, distinct, succinct argument giving the 'ultimate proof
of creation', a conclusion that cannot logically be countered by non-
Christians.
So why 3/4 of an hour later has he still not given us that ? He
has just argued his worldview for 50 minutes. That is not a distinct
'proof', let alone a succinct one. I doubt the book he is selling does
it either.
He starts from a false preposition in any case. When he says:
"All presuppositions start from the Bible" and he claims that there is no
logic which does not 'stand on the Bible / word of god', he is arguing
from a false starting point. My immediate question Is "Why ? - Why do
I have to acknowledge that "the fear of the lord is the beginning of knowledge".
The secular argument against that view is NOT "well I know some non-Xians
who know some things", it is "WHO SAYS ???". [Answer: only those who
believe in the validity of their bible.]
He also uses the same old tired arguments re genetics, carbon-dating,
etc that have been rubbished as lines of evidence in Hovind's lectures;
just going on repeating assertions and saying they are accurate, despite
scientific findings to the contrary, does not make them true. Most of the
'arguments' he credits to the non-Christian (eg neutrality) are NOT positions
taken by the secular when arguing against 'blind faith', in my experience, so
learning Lisle's way of countering those would appear to be useless anyway.
by Carlin on 03 October 2013 - 11:10
I have to wonder whether or not the intended audience is Christians alone. Otherwise, if you even entertained such a discussion in the first place, you'd have to go about it in a complete different way, one in which faith in the Bible isn't the anchor. I guess there's nothing wrong with trying to use logic to bolster the faith of a congregation, but if you're going to do that, how can you begin with a statement of faith? Little pisses me off more than watching these pseudo "pastors", "preachers", and "leaders" being spewed en masse out of those bastions of myopic thought that are the modern evangelical seminaries.
by gouda on 03 October 2013 - 12:10
Hi Carlin
What have you done lately besides running down true believers [heart believers.}
Do you know the difference? Why not spend a few hours in a prayer closet,I honestly believe you will truly get the knowledge of what Shtal is all about.
Just a friendly suggestion.
gouda
What have you done lately besides running down true believers [heart believers.}
Do you know the difference? Why not spend a few hours in a prayer closet,I honestly believe you will truly get the knowledge of what Shtal is all about.
Just a friendly suggestion.
gouda
by Carlin on 03 October 2013 - 12:10
...wasn't referring to shtal. Might I suggest that you refrain from opining unfounded assertions as to the extent of others' "knowledge" ? At face value it seems pointedly ignorant.
by gouda on 03 October 2013 - 12:10
Face up to it Carlin,all you have done here is jumping on Christians backs,is that biblical buddy?
Big words and fancy sayings dont make a heart felt Christian.
gouda
Big words and fancy sayings dont make a heart felt Christian.
gouda
by Two Moons on 03 October 2013 - 12:10
gouda,
I think your too preoccupied with that closet you old fraud, true believer my ass.
As usual shtal you've accomplished nothing. I'm just sorry gouda started this and VK4 got you going once more.
Shtal, gouda,
You two have caused harm to the forum with this preaching crusade and you can both go to whatever hell you can imagine for doing so.
Personally I think your both a sad pair of losers.
One's a hater, the other a simpleton.
Moons.
I think your too preoccupied with that closet you old fraud, true believer my ass.
As usual shtal you've accomplished nothing. I'm just sorry gouda started this and VK4 got you going once more.
Shtal, gouda,
You two have caused harm to the forum with this preaching crusade and you can both go to whatever hell you can imagine for doing so.
Personally I think your both a sad pair of losers.
One's a hater, the other a simpleton.
Moons.
by gouda on 03 October 2013 - 13:10
I dont play on both sides of the fence
gouda
gouda
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