Over angulation on front legs - Page 1

I know that most of the people on this site have German bred dogs but maybe someone can give me some ideas. A student of mine bought an American line pup. At three months old it was obvious that the front legs were going to be over angulated to the point that the fetlock joint is on the ground. The pup is now six months old and her vet has told her that since the pup may become lame in the future that she should put the pup to sleep now. I was wondering if anyone had heard of any type of surgery or splints that may help or maybe supliments that will strenghten the tendons. Her vet will not give referals to other veterinarians, so I was wondering if anyone knows of a good orthipedic veterinarian in Northern Califoria that they might recamend. Any help would be apreciated. My student loves her dogs and takes great care of them. She puts an amazing amout of time, energy and training into them all for the love of them. Thank You.

sounds like a normal american line pup, maybe has weak pasterns. she should contact an american breeder and they should be able to give her info on how to deal with it

This is commonly know as "Down pasterns and hocks" Carpal and tarsal subluxation. Runs heavily in some lines. They look as though they are walking on flippers. Seems to start around three months of age and usually resolves around six months or sooner depending on the degree of severity.Some never have problems in the future, some have limping. Some have never recovered. It is my opinion that this is an inherited tendency and affected animals should not be bred. The recommendation is to modify diet, Science Diet, Maintenance is recommended or something with similar protein and fat levels. No supplementation, and keep in a kennel that has a sandy surface if possible.

http://www.mrgsd.com/wiki-german-shepherd-encyclopedia/tiki-read_article.php?articleId=12&PHPSESSID=c961e83dbe9e63bb98ac295e211fd56c Good article with picture

has the pup been raised mostly indoors on slippery floors, like wood, lino, tile, laminate? That can be the cause of such a development. And poor diet. What is this person feeding. Take the pup OFF puppyfood asap. Feed a good adult formula. I recommend Eagle Pack Original Adult (www.eaglepack.com). No treats, no snacks, no substitutes, no additives, no supplements! A couple of friends of mine recently each had a similar case. With the first pup the owner was constantly feeding treats rich in phosphorus which upset the calcium phosphorus balance, meaning the body could not absorb any of the calcium in the food. Result was that this pup had developed rickets even though it was fed a premium quality food, next to all the other jung. A blood test at the vet revealed that. In addition to living exclusively on wooden floors this pup could not walk on his own feet any longer, front and rear. It was disgusting and very sad to look at. That pup was just over 5 months at the time and he has improved a lot since then. He was taken from the owner, put on a proper diet (bloodwork back to normal within 10 days!), had to loose some weitht, and was put on a proper exercise regimen. Inside the pup was always crated, then let out in a large run with grass and dirt several times a day to play with a littermate that was staying with the breeder. 10 minutes at a time several times a day. The structural improvement over the course of the following 6 weeks were very notable and the pup is now walking, running, playing, jumping and overall very happy and content. Structurally he is sound but is still turned out in front and very cowhocked behind. He was very well put together when he left at 8 weeks. He will never fully improve, and he might have some problems later in life because he is not as straight on this legs as maybe he should be. Until then he is sound will have a good quality of life that has no longer made it necessary to put him down. Second case, marble floors, poor diet. Not quite as bad as the above dog, this female recovered pretty quickly with a similar regimen. Off time was in a kennel with a rough concrete floor that has very good footing, plus playtime outside in dirt and grass runs. Again within 6 weeks she showed a remarkable improvement. When I last saw her would say she will recover almost completely. She will be slightly turned out in front still acceptable though and in the rear she straightened out competely. Overall she had gained a lot of strength and firmness back in no time at all, especially in the pastern. Both of these pups were just slightly younger and are doing well now. Email me privately if you want more information. I would not quite write this pup off just yet. And I do have to say that the comment of the vet - put it down now because it may become lame in the future - is pretty out there. IMO anyways. Sounds like the pup is not lame yet. Its body may well adjust to the type of structure it has and make the best of it. Dogs are incredibly resilient and crafty and they are survivors. First thing I would do is change the vet.

Hello, With this kind of problem and the dog being in Ca id take it UC Davis as they have an excellent Vet school and clinic there. http://www.ucdavis.edu/index.html

Please gimme a break, weak pasterns are not only a problem with Am line GSD's. My 100% German showline dog has long, weak pasterns. Take a look at some of the photos on this site for pete sake. It is a problem in all lines of GSD, not only the American lines.

Good Luck with going to U.C. Davis. It has been my experience that they (U.C. Davis) will not take you with out a referral, and since you say the vet will not give any referrals then it will be very difficult to get into U.C.Davis. Maybe someone else has had better luck getting in.

First of all this is very common in American show line GSD's.... and it's true many dogs have weaker pasterns than should be but this is a total down on the pasterns kind of thing. The pasterns seem very long.... like flippers....I would contact the breeder, this kind of stuff is ridiculous..... As for a resolution, I'm not sure what can be done... I highly doubt any change in diet is going to help it... have seen adult dogs the same way... I would however recommend to ANYONE whose vet won't give them a referral, write you a prescription, etc (any of those things where we are working together as a team to help each other) to start looking for a new vet who will work with you.... Very few vets are experts in nutrition, even less in training and behavior and way less in GSD type things... so until you can find someone who is willing to be flexible, I'd keep looking.....

Thank you everyone. I am going to print out your suggestions and give them to the owner of the pup. To answer about flooring. Originally her vet wanted the pup only crated or hand walked so that he wouldn't jar his legs. The owner felt that wouldn't work for the pup both physically or mentaly so she also lets him have run time in a quarter acre grass yard. The pup seemed to do better after running with my pup once or twice a week, but the vet vetoed that. The way to get into U.C.D. is to go to their regular veterinary clinic that does routine care, vaccinations, phyisical exams etc. The vet at the clinic can then refer you to a specialist. The breeder that owns this pup's stud knows very well that she produces these kind of pups. It is common locally to see this problem and you always know where the pup came from. This breeder produces an AKC champion or two every couple of years, so people keep buying her pups. Oh, the stories I could tell you about this person's vet. He had one GSD with Irritable Bowel syndrome on predisone from four months old to a year old before he would do any screening to try to find out what was causine the problem. Thank you again, everybody.